Individual Throttle Bodies on M62?

[mattmartindrift]

I know, from browsing around today, that the Super Sprint headers that are sold bolt onto BOTH, M and S62 engines. This implies the engine mounting geometries with respect to exhaust port locations are the same. That would lead me to believe that they're more alike than some like to admit.


As NNY stated, the mechanical side is only half or less, of the battle. The biggest PITA would be tuning and remaining OBD2 compliant.

I'm too lazy to devote any real time to it, though.

[BimmerBreaker]

I'd say the pic above says yes you can mount multi tb's. YES!!!!!! I wonder if those tb's are off of the S62? People are so eager to say it can't be done. Why???

Wow

I know, from browsing around today, that the Super Sprint headers that are sold bolt onto BOTH, M and S62 engines. This implies the engine mounting geometries with respect to exhaust port locations are the same. That would lead me to believe that they're more alike than some like to admit.


As NNY stated, the mechanical side is only half or less, of the battle. The biggest PITA would be tuning and remaining OBD2 compliant.

I'm too lazy to devote any real time to it, though.

Yeah because the exhausts are the same MUST mean the intakes are the same. The S62 and M62 share headers. I thought that was common knowledge by now...


Putting TBs on an M62 would be a lot of custom work, custom tuning, custom building. This is another case of "Yes you can but WHY THE HECK would you?" for the cost of this build, built and tuned, you can just buy an S62. I really dont understand the obsession with trying to imrpove the M62 when half the mods alone are "Can I put X from the S62 on my M62" when in the end the custom work required will be more than an S62 to begin with

[English]

For some it's not about cost, practicality, or whether you think they should. For some it is about the challenge, exclusivity, and because you think they shouldn't.

[NNY528I]

For some it's not about cost, practicality, or whether you think they should. For some it is about the challenge, exclusivity, and because you think they shouldn't.

Who ever said anything about shouldn't? we just said its not a straight bolt on.

Wow

Yeah because the exhausts are the same MUST mean the intakes are the same. The S62 and M62 share headers. I thought that was common knowledge by now...

I would guess based on the configuration of the cooling system feeds that the head castings are not the same but may be similar.

[mattmartindrift]

Wow

Yeah because the exhausts are the same MUST mean the intakes are the same. The S62 and M62 share headers. I thought that was common knowledge by now...

tell me, why waste money relocating/reshaping a cylinder head when you don't have to? That, for a car company is a HUGE investment in all new tooling, comprehensive FEA analysis, testing, drawing, optimizing and other associated expenditures. considering the E39 was the first mass-produced M5, I'm going to guess that they tried to make it easy as possible. And why if they did decide to redesign, would they only do half?

[English]

Who ever said anything about shouldn't? we just said its not a straight bolt on.

I was more directing my above statement at those who's knee jerk reaction to anything S62 on a M62 is "buy an M5" or "it's not worth it". Not trying to argue a point as to the throttle bodies bolting up.

[BimmerBreaker]

tell me, why waste money relocating/reshaping a cylinder head when you don't have to? That, for a car company is a HUGE investment in all new tooling, comprehensive FEA analysis, testing, drawing, optimizing and other associated expenditures. considering the E39 was the first mass-produced M5, I'm going to guess that they tried to make it easy as possible. And why if they did decide to redesign, would they only do half?

The S62 has rejacketed heads, cooled intake passages, and ITBs. That in itself is very different from the M62. As to why BMW M didnt design new headers and "only did half" who knows? We all know the intake side of the engine is different. Its a fact. The headers are the same but just because the headers are the same doesnt mean the intake side must be too...

[mattmartindrift]

The S62 has rejacketed heads, cooled intake passages, and ITBs. That in itself is very different from the M62. As to why BMW M didnt design new headers and "only did half" who knows? We all know the intake side of the engine is different. Its a fact. The headers are the same but just because the headers are the same doesnt mean the intake side must be too...

right, so, what you're saying is they used the same castings and added some openings for coolant other other peripherals.

so, how exactly is the bolt pattern on the intake ports different? You say fact? Show me measurements or you're just speculating and playing devil's advocate.

[BimmerBreaker]

right, so, what you're saying is they used the same castings and added some openings for coolant other other peripherals.

so, how exactly is the bolt pattern on the intake ports different? You say fact? Show me measurements or you're just speculating and playing devil's advocate.

Where did I say the bolt pattern is different? Just because the bolt pattern is the same doesnt mean the heads are the same, or even compatible.

[mattmartindrift]

you're arguing for the sake of arguing on speculation only.

[BimmerBreaker]

you're arguing for the sake of arguing on speculation only.

No, the heads are different. Rejacketed and with a different intake passage.

Im not speculating they are different. You are speculating they arent.

[mattmartindrift]

No, the heads are different. Rejacketed and with a different intake passage.

Im not speculating they are different. You are speculating they arent.

weird, you can write, and type; but, lack the ability to read.

[NNY528I]

right, so, what you're saying is they used the same castings and added some openings for coolant other other peripherals.

so, how exactly is the bolt pattern on the intake ports different? You say fact? Show me measurements or you're just speculating and playing devil's advocate.

No one knows if they are different, you have no information either way so your speculation is no better than his. What is known is that there are MAJOR differences in the design of the block and of the heads, the castings are not the same. The fact that the Exhaust manifolds are the same is of limited relevance. A good exhaust design is a good design and there is no reason to assume that the fact that the less complex exhaust systems are similar does not lead to the logical conlclusion that the intakes are as well. you are both arguing just to argue.

Perhaps Razahyde could take some of his spare engine parts and try fitting them on a friends 540 to see what there is to see.

[chucksrt]

it is nice to see that not everybody is a zombie, brain washed to believe that parts are not interchangeable nor could they be made to fit. I understand why there is no real info on this, who is parting an S62 engine apart and who is buying the S62 parts on a guess that they may fit their M62. I would be nice to know for sure. I do understand that there would still be work involved even if they did bolt up but it would be a cool project if money wasn't an issue.

[LowAndSlow540]

m62 and s62 blocks are somewhat similar (excluding m62tu). exhaust ports on the head are the same, I use the cat-less s62 headers on my m62tu, and the throttle bodies will bolt up to the m62tu heads, I don't know about the standard m62 heads for sure. same gaskets from BMW. so to answer the original question.......yes they will fit without swapping to s62 heads. I also have to agree that wiring is not the same and programing will have to be done. we attempted this with my initial engine build but it got put on the back shelf due to wiring and programming complications.

as a reader, I notice a lot of posts end up with two people measuring the size of their pecker instead of helping. also see a lot of misinformation. definitely when someone with a 6 cylinder wants to tell 8 cylinder cars what they can and cant do!

hope this helped, tried to answer the OP question without getting distracted by the mumbo jumbo of this thread.

[ninetyseven1]

There is no proof that a VG30DETT from a 1992 300ZX won't swap into an E39 until someone tries either but the odds are that the knowledgeable and experienced people out there will tell you no and that you are foolish to waste your time. And I'll go you one further: If the OP had the breadth of knowledge and skill needed to even attempt something like this, he wouldn't be asking dumb questions; he just do it.

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The stock M62 motor is a great motor.

[rf900rkw]

And this week's winner of the useless thread-dredge is.....

[AnotherGeezer]

hope this helped, tried to answer the OP question without getting distracted by the mumbo jumbo of this thread.

Better late to the party versus never showing up at all I guess.

[Pacmanracing]

Old thread, I know. Just wanted to correct things along with some peoples attitude about solving problems.

The impossible is now made possible thanks to a stubborn swedish enginebuilder (me):
http://pacman.nu/bilder/m60_intake_adapter_cad.jpg
http://pacman.nu/bilder/m60_intake_adapter.jpg
http://pacman.nu/bilder/m60_intake_adapter_kit.jpg
http://pacman.nu/bilder/m60_intake_adapter_mockup.jpg
http://pacman.nu/bilder/m60_intake_adapter_engine.jpg

I sell the adapterkit in pic three for €340 incl shipping within Europe. Worldwide the shipping fee can vary and price be revised.
Its almost bolt-on. Included in the kit is a thread coil kit for converting the M7 intake theading to M6 in order for the bolt pattern to fit, so some tool handling experience is required. I dont think anybody that cant handle a battery drill and a threader will come up with the idea to rebuild their engine though.

The engine in the last pic is a M60/M62 hybrid 4,4-litre with S62 ITBs, custom made plenums bellmouths and piping by Devina Performance (Weld porn artist), charged with a GT45 turbo and put into a Nissan S13 chassies drifting car. The engine is controlled by a Vipec V88 system which control the stock S62 throttle servo. The ITBs however is NOT 100% electric. They are the same mechanic butterflies as all other standard ITBs. They are just mated with a electric servodriven actuator for convienience in the tight space.

[Jopecasa]

links not working for me.

[evomel]

I've looked into this multiple times.. A few ways to get this done ... You can use S65 throttle bodies and modify their fuel rails or you S62 throttle bodies and modify S65 rails or if you are handy and are a good welder you can do a custom one off system... Either way you will still need to fabricate .... There's a few guys who have done this from vac- and on ... It's just by the time you get it all figured out and spent $$$$ you probably could have spent less swapping a S62.

[Bednorski]

I am interested in a set of adapters. Please PM me.

[MParallel]

I am interested in a set of adapters. Please PM me.

The one from the Swedish guy with 1 post in 2015? You better try and contact him and hope he gets an email notification.

With adapters, anything can be mounted anything. ITB's are tricky though. You can't just take a TB and mount it on an intake with an adapter. Well, physically, but making them run good, is a whole different ballgame.

[2cants]

The one from the Swedish guy with 1 post in 2015? You better try and contact him and hope he gets an email notification.

With adapters, anything can be mounted anything. ITB's are tricky though. You can't just take a TB and mount it on an intake with an adapter. Well, physically, but making them run good, is a whole different ballgame.

My M62B44 has M5 ITB with custom fuel rail. 515 HP at crank. So, yes, ITB can be installed.
Engine has cable throttle via geartronic auto blip to control downshifting Holinger SG6. Fun car to drive. I can send photos if needed.