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Thread: Cooling System Bleeding

  1. #51
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    2000 528i

  2. #52
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    you might have a latent heat pump. if so then do not turn on the key, rather perform the static bleeding same as indicated just with the car off, then when completeclose everything up and proceed as indicated, you might have to top up a couple of times but otherwise everything should work just fine.
    >'97 528i, 200000 miles, Hella Xenons, 17" Stilauto wheels, Vogtland Drop Springs, Dynomax Race Muffler, Homelink, 540 brake upgrade, 15mm spacers >'65 & '74 MG Midgets BFC OT Lego Club #48 Manual conversion in process!!!



  3. #53
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    Thanks.

  4. #54
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    A word of warning, I haven't read through the whole topic, but, pour the coolant GRADUALLY. I made the mistake of pouring tons of it in at once, and, well, it shot through the thermostat bleeder. I mean shot about a foot into the air, I had to clean up coolant from everywhere.

  5. #55
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    You are da man NNY528I !
    I recently had my Vanos rebuilt with the new O-rings on my 2001 525i ( removal fan/shroud was a PITA )

    Desided to flush radiator ( not a block ) and install new water pump and termostat from dealer
    I am wating for new tensioners and pulleys and will follow this great write up - very nice video which moves this complicated procedure to easy task

    Good job !
    ~^^~
    Last edited by champaign777; 07-06-2010 at 07:21 PM.

  6. #56
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    Overhauled Coolant

    Recently overhauled cooling, to include drilling the hole in the thermostat. It took several days to bleed all the air out. Thanks for all this info--definitely helped!
    Last edited by shogun; 04-07-2019 at 10:19 AM.

  7. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by tld31 View Post
    Recently overhauled cooling, to include drilling the hole in the thermostat. It took several days to bleed all the air out. Thanks for all this info--definitely helped!
    Should not have had to drill the thermostat nor should it have taken so long to get the air out. Which procedure did you follow, the original one at the top of the thread or the info posted by others, just want to know what you did so I can get some feedback about what worked and what didn't. Usually the static bleed shown in the video results in an air free engine on the first try with no holes drilled as the cooling system is self bleeding and cannot develop an air lock as has been suggested.

    Glad you were able to get things bled out.
    >'97 528i, 200000 miles, Hella Xenons, 17" Stilauto wheels, Vogtland Drop Springs, Dynomax Race Muffler, Homelink, 540 brake upgrade, 15mm spacers >'65 & '74 MG Midgets BFC OT Lego Club #48 Manual conversion in process!!!



  8. #58
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    As I mentioned previously,

    1. Hole in thermostat. For some reasons, Wahler and Behr, when making thermostats for BMW, they usually do not install the hole. So BMW indy mechanics have been drilling the hole in thermostat for years to prevent air lock.
    However, when Wahler or Behr make thermostats for VW and Volvo, they build a hole in there from factory to prevent air lock. So go figure!

    *** Attached picture shows a typical VW thermostat with hole pre-drilled from factory.

    Drilling a hole in the 1997-98 models' thermostat is completely optional. The main reason I drilled a hole in the thermostat is that: although I might have been fine with no hole, I simply did not want to deal with air lock.
    I have had this air lock issues with my E23 (1983 735i) and Porsche engines before.

    Four (4) years and 20K miles later, absolutely no issues with the tiny hole in the thermostat in my car.

    2. Air lock phenomenon (air trapped inside the engine block) is a distinct entity. This has been in existence since the invention of mechanical thermostat. It was an issue and it will be an issue in many gasoline engines, not just BMW engines.

    Knowledge is power.

    In doubt? Do a Google search on these issues.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by cnn; 07-20-2010 at 11:14 PM.

  9. #59
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    Air lock is an engine cooling system design issue, not a thermostat issue. Please cnn go back and answer the questions i asked you before pertaining to the design elements and interconnections in the cooling system plumbing around the thermostat. for example, MG engines have a top mounted thermostat that is the high point in the system and thus without a bleeder in the thermostat(small hole) they could become air locked.

    You have already changed your tune on the air lock in front of the thermostat(in the lower radiator hose) when confronted with photographs of the air bleed hole, then suddenly you determined that the air lock is on the inner side of the thermostat. Nor have you recanted your earlier disinformation regarding the elevations on the bleeder screws even when confronted with photographic proof that they are not at the same elevation as you have stated.

    This engine BY DESIGN cannot become air locked as you describe, the air can ALWAYS get out of the area around the thermostat. The upper radiator hose and the inner side of the thermostat are connected and share a water passage thus there is no way for the air to become trapped back there. This is my only point. On many cars there is a possibility for air lock(even many earlier BMWs) but on this car it cannot occur.
    Last edited by shogun; 04-07-2019 at 10:20 AM.
    >'97 528i, 200000 miles, Hella Xenons, 17" Stilauto wheels, Vogtland Drop Springs, Dynomax Race Muffler, Homelink, 540 brake upgrade, 15mm spacers >'65 & '74 MG Midgets BFC OT Lego Club #48 Manual conversion in process!!!



  10. #60
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    My tune has always been the same.
    The issue of air lock inside the engine block is the point of discussion.

    As I mentioned previously: "Air Lock" occurs in 2 separate fashions:
    a- when air is trapped behind the thermostat, inside the engine block ---> can be difficult to get rid off.
    b- when air is trapped in the tstat housing ---> very easy to get rid off.

    "Originally posted by cnn,
    ....If your car is on level ground, look carefully, you will see that the thermostat housing bleed screw (#1) is located at the same level as the reservoir neck and not at the "KALT" mark on the reservoir.
    See the Lavender Arrows in the attached Picture...."
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by cnn; 07-21-2010 at 09:21 AM.

  11. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by cnn View Post
    My tune has always been the same.
    The issue of air lock inside the engine block is the point of discussion.

    As I mentioned previously: "Air Lock" occurs in 2 separate fashions:
    a- when air is trapped behind the thermostat, inside the engine block ---> can be difficult to get rid off.
    b- when air is trapped in the tstat housing ---> very easy to get rid off.
    But that is the whole point, air cannot get trapped in the block as the area behind the thermostat is directly connected through an open passage to the upper radiator hose. the main exit for the coolant flow passes behind the thermostat and into the upper radiator hose passage with no restriction whatsoever. The air cant get trapped back there it will escape into the radiator(past the thermostat cover bleed screw on its way.




    as to the radiator neck thing, what is the point of that observation????? the high point of the system is the upper bleed screw on the expansion tank. That side of the expansion tank is air free and full of coolant when the system is fully purged(its discharge is below the level in the open part of the tank that is why you need to bleed all the way to the top of the bleeder.
    Last edited by NNY528I; 07-21-2010 at 08:12 PM.
    >'97 528i, 200000 miles, Hella Xenons, 17" Stilauto wheels, Vogtland Drop Springs, Dynomax Race Muffler, Homelink, 540 brake upgrade, 15mm spacers >'65 & '74 MG Midgets BFC OT Lego Club #48 Manual conversion in process!!!



  12. #62
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    Can you overfill the coolant? I just had a new radiator replaced. I checked the coolant level in the expansion tank, the indicator raised to the highest point and could not raise any higher.

  13. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shawn C View Post
    Can you overfill the coolant? I just had a new radiator replaced. I checked the coolant level in the expansion tank, the indicator raised to the highest point and could not raise any higher.
    During normal use, keep coolant as specified by COLD mark on the reservoir (engine cold). Overfilling is not a good idea, the system needs some air space (at the top 1/4 of the reservoir) for coolant expansion.

    When performing work on cooling system (such as replacing water pump), there is always some air getting into the system during the work, so I usually fill about 2 inches above COLD mark. This way, during the bleeding process, it turns out perfect anyway. Speaking from my own experience.

  14. #64
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    Thanks for the response. How do I drain off the excess coolant? Where is the drain valve?

  15. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shawn C View Post
    Thanks for the response. How do I drain off the excess coolant? Where is the drain valve?
    To drain excess coolant, use a Turkey Baster to suck out excess coolant and dispose of it properly.

    Never suck coolant out by mouth using a tube. If ingested, coolant typically contains methanol, which will be converted by alcohol dehydrogenase (the same enzyme that metabolizes your beer, wine alcohol) into formic acid. Formic Acid will cause blindness (accumulated in the lens of the eyes).

    So ---> Turkey Baster.

  16. #66
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    Or just use the expansion tank bleeder with the engine off and heater on.

  17. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by cnn View Post
    To drain excess coolant, use a Turkey Baster to suck out excess coolant and dispose of it properly.

    Never suck coolant out by mouth using a tube. If ingested, coolant typically contains methanol, which will be converted by alcohol dehydrogenase (the same enzyme that metabolizes your beer, wine alcohol) into formic acid. Formic Acid will cause blindness (accumulated in the lens of the eyes).

    So ---> Turkey Baster.
    I am not aware of any automotive or machinery type coolant which contains methanol in any meaningful proportion. I dont think Methanol has been used in automotive cooling systems if it ever was widely used for the better part of 100 years. It has much wider use as a fuel (many many racing applications)than as an antifreeze when it comes to vehicles.

    Engine Coolant does however contain Ethylene Glycol, Diethylene Glycol, Sebacic Acid, Sodium hydroxide(from the BMW coolant bottle FYI) and other not so good for you constituents.

    Ethylene Glycol in particular is poisonous but not horribly so but ingestion should be avoided.

    Methanol is used in washer fluid and in drygas additives.

    Quote Originally Posted by MehMan View Post
    Or just use the expansion tank bleeder with the engine off and heater on.

    no nothing would come out at that bleeder screw, if you drain from the thermostat cover and do not touch the expansion tank bleeder then you will be able to set the level a little closer.

    I would be less worried about the stick popping up and more I would ensure that there is at least 2 or 3 inches of head space in the tank.
    Last edited by NNY528I; 07-22-2010 at 05:11 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
    >'97 528i, 200000 miles, Hella Xenons, 17" Stilauto wheels, Vogtland Drop Springs, Dynomax Race Muffler, Homelink, 540 brake upgrade, 15mm spacers >'65 & '74 MG Midgets BFC OT Lego Club #48 Manual conversion in process!!!



  18. #68
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    My car has been running fine, temperature always around 96 degrees celsius.

    The way I sucked out the extra coolant is quite easy. I use a plastic bottle with a hose, squeezed the bottle to contract it, put the hose into the coolant reservior cap submerged with coolant, then let the bottle expand back, sucking coolant out. As soon as the coolant is sucked into the hose, keep the hose and the bottle lower than the coolant reservoir. Gravity will do the rest, watch the level because it is going to suck coolant out really fast!

  19. #69
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    Hi NNY528i, i replaced my water pump and tstat on Wednesday. Had the front of the car on ramps and after doing that I followed your instructions to the letter. All went very smoothly. Hardly any bubbles came out.. just clean coolant. Could it be because the new tstat i got had a hole in it? Anyway took the car for a reasonable drive and needle remained solid at center.Only thing is for the past few days now I've been checking the coolant level first thing in the morning .. the coolant level seems to remain well above the 'kalt' mark. Should i suck some of it out?

  20. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by leister View Post
    Hi NNY528i, i replaced my water pump and tstat on Wednesday. Had the front of the car on ramps and after doing that I followed your instructions to the letter. All went very smoothly. Hardly any bubbles came out.. just clean coolant. Could it be because the new tstat i got had a hole in it? Anyway took the car for a reasonable drive and needle remained solid at center.Only thing is for the past few days now I've been checking the coolant level first thing in the morning .. the coolant level seems to remain well above the 'kalt' mark. Should i suck some of it out?
    It cant hurt, as long as its stable you can suck out the excess with a turkey baster to just above the cold mark.
    >'97 528i, 200000 miles, Hella Xenons, 17" Stilauto wheels, Vogtland Drop Springs, Dynomax Race Muffler, Homelink, 540 brake upgrade, 15mm spacers >'65 & '74 MG Midgets BFC OT Lego Club #48 Manual conversion in process!!!



  21. #71
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    Procedure worked perfectly...

    I have never had a problem with any of my 6cyl BMW's until today and the cold bleed got rid of all the air I had.

    Thank you!

  22. #72
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    Seems to be working for my '01 M54 just fine. Just did whole system & NPG+, believe I will have a little more air to clear from the tank over the next day or two, but so far, simple & easy DIY for bleeding. Thanks.

  23. #73
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    Can someone tell me why after changing out the waterpump, thermostat, all the hoses and radiator. I get into he car and put the key to the on position and the needle for the coolant temp goes to the right temp and then a sec later goes past the red mark and stays there unless u turn the car off n then back on or to the on position and the it repeats the same thing.. I'm trying to bleed the system but Having the needle hang out in that red mark scares the crap outta me..

    Btw it's a 2003 540i m package , I'm starting to think it's a fault sensor that's sending the wrong info to the cluster
    Last edited by NarlyM3; 10-21-2010 at 05:22 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

  24. #74
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    This is strange. 2 months ago the level was at the highest and now it's like 4 inches below the top. I suspect the seals in the cap is shot so I bought a new expansion tank cap.

    Hopefully they did a good job when replacing the radiator. Actually my radiator was good but because the mechanic told me to change the top hose then he broke the fragile hose neck. Good thing he only charged me his cost of $125 for the radiator including labor.
    Last edited by Shawn C; 10-21-2010 at 07:09 PM.

  25. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by NarlyM3 View Post
    Can someone tell me why after changing out the waterpump, thermostat, all the hoses and radiator. I get into he car and put the key to the on position and the needle for the coolant temp goes to the right temp and then a sec later goes past the red mark and stays there unless u turn the car off n then back on or to the on position and the it repeats the same thing.. I'm trying to bleed the system but Having the needle hang out in that red mark scares the crap outta me..

    Btw it's a 2003 540i m package , I'm starting to think it's a fault sensor that's sending the wrong info to the cluster
    Answered your PM but I suspect a loose or disconnected wire is your problem.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shawn C View Post
    This is strange. 2 months ago the level was at the highest and now it's like 4 inches below the top. I suspect the seals in the cap is shot so I bought a new expansion tank cap.

    Hopefully they did a good job when replacing the radiator. Actually my radiator was good but because the mechanic told me to change the top hose then he broke the fragile hose neck. Good thing he only charged me his cost of $125 for the radiator including labor.
    I suspect you have a small leak somewhere in the system. this is not at all uncommon and they can be hard to spot sometimes. the best indicator is the presence of white salty looking deposits you may have to really poke around for them.
    Last edited by NNY528I; 10-24-2010 at 08:10 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
    >'97 528i, 200000 miles, Hella Xenons, 17" Stilauto wheels, Vogtland Drop Springs, Dynomax Race Muffler, Homelink, 540 brake upgrade, 15mm spacers >'65 & '74 MG Midgets BFC OT Lego Club #48 Manual conversion in process!!!



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