1/4 mile results: M3 with bolt-ons **videos**

[jworms]

I still don't get how you managed to chirp 2nd and 3rd, and for that matter I don't understand how m3chaser spins in 2nd. I've never experienced such traction issues with my car, and I should be making more power at the wheels than both of you. I'm running 245/30 Yoko S-Drives in the rear and I barely chirp 2nd.

Quick question though, why do you guys launch so high (5-6k)? Granted I've yet to go to the strip, but whenever I'm messing around with friends I launch at about 3,500 and it seems to work pretty well (pulled a length on an '03 RS6 from 0-100, they run ~13.5). The car doesn't really seem to bog and all I get is a tiny bit of wheel-hop, maybe it's cuz the cams shifted my torque curve to the right?

Either way your traction issues befuddle me

the reason for launching so high is to have the car in the meat of the powerband right from the start. silverstreak made a great post about this many years ago on here: http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...ad.php?t=47538

i think the reason for me chirping 2nd and 3rd might be from what ltw97m3 and m3luckyoo were talking about in that i wasn't getting the most from my DRs. i'll try to do some experimenting and report back my findings. i never had any chirping problems with the 255/40/17 rcomp tires i used previously and these DRs should be much better for traction.

When you're trying to get a US spec e36 M3 in the 12's w/ just N/A mods, every little bit counts

yep, true. if i remember right, the back seats weigh in at around 40lbs.

[m3luckyoo]

On street tires 3500-4000 rpm launches are fine- we launch high to get the power (meat of the powerband) down to the ground and with sticky tires your engine tends to bog if you dont put down enough power before your tires grip.

DRs and slicks operate as an "instant" grip type of affect. Street tires have more of a "gradual" grip. I liken it to this: DRs/ Slicks= Simple lamp on/off switch. Street tires= lamp dimmer switch where you have to slide it up and down for eventual on/off grip. lol.

For the record my 13.7 pass on street tires I launched at 3500 or so. I always drop the clutch at the launch rpm and floor it then I adjust tirespin/ eventual grip by letting off the accelerator a bit- then as soon as the tire grips I floor it again.

[BMWFanatic]

I still don't get how you managed to chirp 2nd and 3rd, and for that matter I don't understand how m3chaser spins in 2nd. I've never experienced such traction issues with my car, and I should be making more power at the wheels than both of you. I'm running 245/30 Yoko S-Drives in the rear and I barely chirp 2nd.

Quick question though, why do you guys launch so high (5-6k)? Granted I've yet to go to the strip, but whenever I'm messing around with friends I launch at about 3,500 and it seems to work pretty well (pulled a length on an '03 RS6 from 0-100, they run ~13.5). The car doesn't really seem to bog and all I get is a tiny bit of wheel-hop, maybe it's cuz the cams shifted my torque curve to the right?

Either way your traction issues befuddle me

Your car might be making more power than them but if you have no weight reduction like jworms(2860lbs) and M3chaser(2930lbs) then your car should be over 300lbs more than them resulting in more traction for you.

That and maybe you dont shift as fast?

[racer m]

Jworms,
Not that this would matter much on a 1/4 mile, but what type of suspension are you using?

[99MPower]

suspension matters a TON in regards to being able to launch and get good traction

[jworms]

Jworms,
Not that this would matter much on a 1/4 mile, but what type of suspension are you using?

hah...yeah...i'm running stock suspension with 111,000 miles on it...

the best part about it is when i go to a track with turns () and you see the massive amounts of body roll emanating from my car

suspension matters a TON in regards to being able to launch and get good traction

definitely true. in fact, this is something i recently learned more about. i always thought you would want soft suspension to allow the back to squat more and create more traction...guess that's not true. mrblonde (a frequent drag racing section visitor on here and all-around very knowledgeable guy when it comes to drag racing) mentioned that stiff suspension is actually the way to go on these cars with their IRS.

here's a few threads where it has been mentioned:
http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...4#post14466054

http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...2#post15083792

http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...php?p=18071589
(got psi seems to agree in this thread...and if you've seen his drag car build, you know he's probably got the experience to know about this stuff )

the only thing my setup has going for it is the poly bushings i have in the rear - which, after installation, was a night/day difference for traction on my car. other than that, my suspension is probably as soft as it gets.

[KnudsonsM3]

Nice runs bro!

[ForceFed7]

hah...yeah...i'm running stock suspension with 111,000 miles on it...

definitely true. in fact, this is something i recently learned more about. i always thought you would want soft suspension to allow the back to squat more and create more traction...guess that's not true. mrblonde (a frequent drag racing section visitor on here and all-around very knowledgeable guy when it comes to drag racing) mentioned that stiff suspension is actually the way to go on these cars with their IRS.

Very true. Atleast for suspension that has high mileage on it. When I went from tired and old OEM suspension on my 540I/6 to the Bav Auto Sport kit which consists of Billy sports + Bav Auto springs, I was able to shave a consistent tenth of my 60 and 2-2.5 tenths in the 1/8th. That carries over to the back end at the very least. Atleast this has been my experience. Stiffer is better for the E39 for launches BUT you must have a decent tire or atleast a WIDE crappy tire if you want to experience the full benefit.

[Serious]

still don't really understand the point of trying to prove the car can get into the 12's but good luck man.

[KnudsonsM3]

still don't really understand the point of trying to prove the car can get into the 12's but good luck man.

because thats very quick

and its his passion


its fun to set goals and achieve them

[Maximum55]

awesome driving man, noob question...in the second video why do you burn out in 2nd gear not 1st?

[ForceFed7]

awesome driving man, noob question...in the second video why do you burn out in 2nd gear not 1st?

Put more heat into the DRs quicker. Faster rotations of the tire = more friction = more heat sooner.

[iamnotsakred]

still don't really understand the point of trying to prove the car can get into the 12's but good luck man.

Considering that only a few people can get into the 12's NA with these cars, and even fewer yet with similar setup to Jon's. I would say its a notable achievement, especially on a west coast track.

Hammad

[jworms]

Very true. Atleast for suspension that has high mileage on it. When I went from tired and old OEM suspension on my 540I/6 to the Bav Auto Sport kit which consists of Billy sports + Bav Auto springs, I was able to shave a consistent tenth of my 60 and 2-2.5 tenths in the 1/8th. That carries over to the back end at the very least. Atleast this has been my experience. Stiffer is better for the E39 for launches BUT you must have a decent tire or atleast a WIDE crappy tire if you want to experience the full benefit.

wow, that's a huge difference! i can only assume that suspension is in the future for my car (probably not anytime soon, that shiz is expensive!), but at least i know when it does happen it will improve everything about the car. good information!

still don't really understand the point of trying to prove the car can get into the 12's but good luck man.

hah! i figured you of all people would understand.

Put more heat into the DRs quicker. Faster rotations of the tire = more friction = more heat sooner.

yep!

it's funny, one of the mercedes guys and i were talking after one of my runs and i was telling him about my traction woes to which he responded, "you should cut down on your burnout time and heat the tires up to around 100mph real quick, then do your run." ...to which i responded, "yeah...it's not as easy to do a 100mph burnout in a car with little torque and a manual transmission "

[Hetzle]

the reason for launching so high is to have the car in the meat of the powerband right from the start. silverstreak made a great post about this many years ago on here: http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...ad.php?t=47538

i think the reason for me chirping 2nd and 3rd might be from what ltw97m3 and m3luckyoo were talking about in that i wasn't getting the most from my DRs. i'll try to do some experimenting and report back my findings. i never had any chirping problems with the 255/40/17 rcomp tires i used previously and these DRs should be much better for traction.

Makes more sense to me, I've yet to launch that high in my car, but I guess I'll need to practice for when I make my way over to the strip

Your car might be making more power than them but if you have no weight reduction like jworms(2860lbs) and M3chaser(2930lbs) then your car should be over 300lbs more than them resulting in more traction for you.

That and maybe you dont shift as fast?

Yeah I've only removed the spare and trunk lining, I wanna run my car at a DD'able weight (rear seats and everything, probably get a LTW battery at least) so that way I'll know what I can match up against in a real world situation.

And yeah he shifts fast but it doesn't seem any faster than me when I'm really going at it, plus my clutch has barely 1000 miles on it and grabs like a mofo

[Haifisch M3]

suspension matters a TON in regards to being able to launch and get good traction

+1,
mainly the rear shocks. If they are gone, the drive wheels won't be planted= loss of traction.

[m3chaser]

And yeah he shifts fast but it doesn't seem any faster than me when I'm really going at it, plus my clutch has barely 1000 miles on it and grabs like a mofo

Ya know I always hear guys say they can shift fast, but when it comes down to it they only think they can shift fast. I have not yet come up against anyone who can shift faster than me, but have come up against a couple guys who can shift as fast.

Get yourself out to the track and see what the car traps. The ET is all about launch and of course shifting helps some as well, but the trap speed will show you how much power you are making.

Oh and for the record, my car is 2950lbs without me in the car and about 3115lbs with me in the car. The car certainly isn't that much of a lightweight and I don't have very much taken out of the car at all. the factory sub is still in the car as is the sun shade for the hatch.

[m3luckyoo]

Ya know I always hear guys say they can shift fast, but when it comes down to it they only think they can shift fast. I have not yet come up against anyone who can shift faster than me, but have come up against a couple guys who can shift as fast.

Get yourself out to the track and see what the car traps. The ET is all about launch and of course shifting helps some as well, but the trap speed will show you how much power you are making.

Oh and for the record, my car is 2950lbs without me in the car and about 3115lbs with me in the car. The car certainly isn't that much of a lightweight and I don't have very much taken out of the car at all. the factory sub is still in the car as is the sun shade for the hatch.

Your forgetting that your gears have a lot to do with you fast 13.2 1/4 mile time. You might not be as lightweight as others but gears get you off that launch like a bat out of hell. lol.

[Nj85'325]

Have you dyno'd the car? Just curious at what horsepower level your at. Im thinkin closer to the 250 side of things.

[Hetzle]

Ya know I always hear guys say they can shift fast, but when it comes down to it they only think they can shift fast. I have not yet come up against anyone who can shift faster than me, but have come up against a couple guys who can shift as fast.

Get yourself out to the track and see what the car traps. The ET is all about launch and of course shifting helps some as well, but the trap speed will show you how much power you are making.

Oh and for the record, my car is 2950lbs without me in the car and about 3115lbs with me in the car. The car certainly isn't that much of a lightweight and I don't have very much taken out of the car at all. the factory sub is still in the car as is the sun shade for the hatch.

Only reason I say that is because I've gotten comments from a bunch of people who track their cars a lot, I never thought I shifted fast until people told me so but yeah I'll have to wait til summer for track results, I'm excited

[dRock13]

my dr's like real heavy john force style burnouts =]

[jworms]

Have you dyno'd the car? Just curious at what horsepower level your at. Im thinkin closer to the 250 side of things.

242rwhp and 232rwtq

graphs here:
http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...d.php?t=801802

[m3chaser]

Your forgetting that your gears have a lot to do with you fast 13.2 1/4 mile time. You might not be as lightweight as others but gears get you off that launch like a bat out of hell. lol.

They certainly have something to do with it, but with just a M50 and Catback I ran a 13.48@100mph. The gears took off 2 tenths and gave me a little more than 2mph.

[jworms]

They certainly have something to do with it, but with just a M50 and Catback I ran a 13.48@100mph. The gears took off 2 tenths and gave me a little more than 2mph.

man, i wish i had your gearing! the sizing on my DR only make it worse with effectively turning my 3.46 diff into a 3.36. i think with a 3.73 i'd be pretty close to redline when i cross the finish ...i can only guess what kind of results would come of that situation

[m3luckyoo]

Ya no kidding. I have heard that 3.63-3.73 gears are the sweetspot for these cars. Definitely on the future mod list after I get a fresh engine =P