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Thread: Crankcase/Oil Seperator (CCV) (M52)

  1. #1
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    Crankcase/Oil Seperator (CCV) (M52)

    This thread is to tie two M52 DIYs together.

    First DIY.

    http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=379225
    Quote Originally Posted by cn90;
    I just finished this 8-hour massive job and here is the DIY. This is a "Quadruple" Job:
    1- Replacing Oil Line to Vanos (mine is leaking).
    2- Replacing CCV and hoses (preventive).
    3- Cleaning ICV and replace its hoses (preventive).
    4- Cleaning Alternator Air Duct and Installed Gutter Guard to prevent leaves from being sucked in.

    GENERAL NOTES:
    * This is a job that you want to do some research before doing it. These CCV and ICV hose routing details vary from year to year so look up PN at:
    http://www.realoem.com
    It is a lot of labor removing the Intake Manifold so any cheap parts (gaskets etc.) should be replaced to prevent repeating labor later.

    * Park the car in garage so if you have to stop and do it the next day it is OK. Do Not park the car at a critical spot (it is not fun to push 4000 lbs of steel so other cars can move!) because once things are removed you cannot drive the car. Things can go wrong (happened to me!), you may have to stop and order new parts etc. Do it on a Friday or Saturday so you can run to dealer if you encounter problems.
    Budget a whole day for this.

    * Use different ziplock bags to label different nuts/bolts so when re-installing you are not confused!

    * When lifting up the Intake Manifold, take some digital pictures. Spend at least 5-10 minutes to look underneath carefully and make a mental note of how things run. It is a crowded place with a lot of hoses running like Spaghetti!

    * Get an assorted mixture of vacuum hoses, heater hoses (ID = 1/2") and hoses with different diameters to replace different rubber hoses.

    * To remove old rubber hoses that bond to the metal line, use a putty knife and gently cut the hose where it mates with the metal connector. Just go slowly so you don't damage the connector.

    * When replacing old vacuum hoses, replace one at a time to avoid mixup!

    * The two (2) coolant hoses that feed to the Throttle Body (labeled Green #9 in Figure 4) are still good so I decided to leave them alone.

    * I marked all rubber hoses with white liquid paper and labeled 09 so later at a glance I know which hoses were replaced in 2009!

    * When dealing with 10-mm bolts/nuts and 11-mm nuts, use proper torque to avoid stripping the threads.

    * The Ventilation Pipe 11151703775 connects the CCV to the Valve Cover. It is rather expensive ($24.41) for a simple piece of tubing. I measured the O.D. of the Valve Cover and the ICV outlet, it is 1 inch, so if you want to save money then use any Standard Heater Hose with I.D. = 1 inch with clamps, and this should work well!

    * My CCV looks good (see Figure 7) at 103K! In theory, one can clean the CCV well with Throttle Cleaner and re-install it to save $76 for stupid device. It is simply an oil separator that returns oil back to the oil pan via the dipstick. Anyway, I bought a new CCV so the new CCV goes in.
    My ICV also looks great at 103K! You can see that with mostly highway driving, there is very little accumulation of gunk.

    * To clean the ICV, spray the ICV with Throttle Cleaner, use a Q-tip if you have a lot of gunk. Then let it dry.

    Parts List from:
    http://www.eactuning.com
    11151703775----Ventilation Pipe GENUINE BMW --> $24.41
    11361703464----Oil Line COHLINE --> $46.74
    11151703484----Oil Separator GENUINE BMW --> $76.07
    13411733217-----Grommet GENUINE BMW --> $10.24 x 2 = $20.48 (there are 2 of these: one for the CCV and one for the ICV.)
    11151740393----Ventilation Hose CONTITECH --> $4.46
    11611716174----Throttle Housing Gasket VICTOR REINZ --> $5.40
    (This is the gasket between the Throttle and the Plastic Intake Manifold)
    13411740950----Air Hose GENUINE BMW --> $8.61
    (This goes from ICV to Rubber Boot).
    13541703703----Connection Piece, this piece very cheap (about $1.00), and it connects to the above Air Hose. After removing the original piece it is still very good. So this part is optional. Replace it if you wish, but also OK to re-use it if it is good. It is plastic, not rubber.

    From Dealer (It was a Friday and I needed these parts right away!)
    13541703693----DSC Throttle Gasket --> $6.10
    (This is gasket between DSC Throttle and the Main Throttle)
    11611740069----Intake Manifold Gaskets x 2 (you need two) --> $16.00 x 2 = $32.00
    (You can buy this online for $6.00/each. I was stuck because I took everything apart so I went to dealer and paid $16.00/each! But that is OK with me as well!)

    OK, enough talking....let's start:

    1. First read this Intake Manifold Removal DIY:
    http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=318750
    * In My DIY, there is no need to disconnect fuel lines as mentioned in the above link. The Fuel Lines simply twist along its axis. Note that I use a 2 x 4 piece of Lumber to support the manifold. Read on.

    2. Disconnect battery ground cable.

    3. Remove Air Filter-Air Mass Meter as a Unit.
    Figure 1: Remove the 10-mm bolt, loosen clamps on Intake Rubber Boot.


    Figure 1a: Remove the two (2) 5-mm Allen bolts holding the DCS throttle.


    4. Figure 2 shows view AFTER Air Filter-Air Mass Meter removed as a Unit.
    ]

    5. Figure 3 shows Intake Rubber Boot removed.
    Notice:
    - The Main throttle is nice and clean after 103K miles (mostly highway driving), but I cleaned it with Throttle Cleaner anyway.
    - Grease the Throttle Cables while you are there.


    6. Figure 4 is a busy picture. It shows the bolts you need to remove:
    - Six (6) 10-mm bolts circled in red:
    Bolt #1 holds a Vacuum Device
    Bolts #2, 3, 4 hold the CCV
    Bolts #5, 6 hold the ICV
    - Two (2) 10-mm bolts circled in green:
    Bolts #7, 8 hold the Intake Manifold
    * No need to remove the 13-mm bolts holding down the bracket (circled in Orange) to the Engine Block!


    Figure 4a shows you things to remove:
    - The POSITIVE battery post (this is WHY you need to disconnect the battery for this job!). It is a 19-mm bolt, be gentle when removing this bolt. Then using screwdriver the pry the connector so it drops down away from the Intake Manifold.
    - Hose to CCV, and 2 Connectors on fuel rails.


    Figure 4b shows you the Tricky part: How to remove the seven (7) 11-mm nuts holding the Intake Manifold without dropping the nuts into the blackhole!
    - My trick: apply some grease to the 11-mm socket so it holds the nut when you remove it, put a telescoping magnet alongside the socket to magnetize the socket and catch the nut. The other way is to slowly remove the nut until loose, then re-install it back about 1-2 turns or so, then use the magnetic telescope to unscrew it.
    - When re-installing the nuts, use the telescope magnet to start the thread (apply a bit of grease so the nuts go in easily)!
    - The last nut next to the firewall (circled in red): use an 11-mm wrench. A socket will not fit in there!
    - To disconnect the Hose to CCV (Circled in Orange), squeeze the outside plastic ring (it is oblong in shape so squeeze the long ends and pull the connector out, it is held by an O-ring so it may be stiff from years of engine heat.)


    When lifting the Intake Manifold:
    - Do it slowly so you can disconnect appropriate hoses/connectors etc. Make a note of where things go for ease of re-installation. Again, the hoses and connectors under the Intake Manifold look like a whole bunch of Spaghetti, so take a pic for ease of re-installation. Also, try to do this job in one single day so your memory is fresh.
    - Watch the two (2) fuel lines, they can twist a bit around their O-ring connections. Do not worry about this.
    - Remove the Oil Dipstick and cover the Dipstick Tube with ZipLock Bag/Rubber band to prevent dirt from coming in.

    7. Figure 5 shows you the Intake Manifold lifted up to show parts.
    Do an inspection of all the small vacuum hoses.
    I replace the small vacuum hoses anyway (using standard vacuum hoses).


    8. Figure 6 shows you my TRICK of using 2 x 4 lumber and Shop Towel so the Intake Manifold can rest on. This way you do not have to disconnect the fuel lines!


    9. Replace Oil Line to Vanos: It is 19-mm Banjo-Type Bolt: I re-used the washers. If you re-use the washers, pay attention to the orientation of the washers so the orientation is the same (these washers are slightly indented after squeezed by the bolt so make sure they go back the same way).
    Of course you can use new washers.
    Torque these 19-mm Bolts to 32 Nm.

    10. Replace CCV + hoses: Straightforward business.
    - Note that the CCV mates into the Intake Manifold sideway via the Rubber Grommet so push the CCV toward the engine (from driver to pass side).
    - The hose from CCV to the dipstick is standard 1/2-inch I.D. Heater Hose (you can get it at any Auto Parts Store).
    - When installing the new CCV, do not connect the 11151703775----Ventilation Pipe at this time.

    11. Remove ICV; clean it and re-install with new hoses: Straightforward business.

    PS: As you can see, if your driving is mostly highway (air cooling the engine compartment as opposed to stop and go traffic in NY City!), the Main throttle is clean at 103K miles! The CCV and ICV have very little gunk, and the Valve Stems look good at 103K miles (Figures 7 and 8).



    12. While everything is exposed, time to clean the Alternator Air Duct:
    - Alternator Positive Cable is held by 13-mm nut.
    - Alternator Plastic cover is held by two (2) 8-mm nuts.
    - Clean the leaves/debris using a vacuum machine. Remember to clean the Intake Duct (under the bumper) as well.
    - Figure 9 shows you how to install Gutter Guard. I could not find it in black so I bought the Brown Gutter Guard at Lowes Hardware and painted it black. Then cut it to size and place it in front of the Intake Duct (under the bumper) to prevent leaves/birds from getting inside, secure it with a few zip ties. Nobody will notice that you put a Gutter Guard there!


    During Re-installation:
    1. Do NOT over-torque the 10-mm and 11-mm nuts/bolts, it is easy to strip them.
    2. Install the Ventilation Pipe 11151703775 (CCV to the Valve Cover) at the end because you need access to the 11-mm nut holding the Intake Manifold.
    3. Do not forget the Positive Post (when lowering the manifold, slide the positive post into the Intake Manifold. Then later tighten the 19-mm Bolt snug (finger tight) and maybe going from 12 o'clock to 1 o'clock position. There is no need to over-torque this bolt. If you over-torque this bolt, you can crack the Plastic Intake Manifold, now it is $633!!!
    4. Using a flashlight and check everything from hoses to connectors (do not forget the Intake Air Temp Sensor Connector). I also forgot it!
    5. Re-connect battery cable at the very end. If you cannot open your trunk (remember the battery ground cable was disconnected), so you will need to use your key to manually open the trunk to access the battery. Remember to set the trunk lock back to Vertical position (do a search and you will know why I say this)!
    6. Start the car and check for:
    - Oil leak at Oil Line to Vanos connections x 2.
    - Any Fuel Leak (there are a total of 4 connections to check near the firewall). The Fuel Hoses are labeled in Figure 2.
    - Test-drive the car.

    So, this is what I learned from this DIY (Live and Learn!):
    - At 103K, my CCV and ICV still looks very good but since I have to replace the Oil Line to Vanos (it is wet!), I may as well do the whole shebang!
    - For those of you driving mainly highway (hwy driving produces much less gunk than stop-and-go driving), you can delay the CCV and ICV job until 150K miles or so. My CCV and ICV were OK even at 103K miles (primarily highway driving)
    - The Alternator needs cleaning and Gutter Guard below bumper. You have 2 options:
    1. Leaving the Air Duct Cover off so it looks like any other car with standard alternator.
    2. Install the Gutter Guard.

    - Removing the Air Filter Housing gives you excellent access to a lot of stuff (PS Low-Pressure and High-Pressure Hoses, Heater Hoses, Vacuum Lines, Left Engine Mount).
    - If you are short of budget, many of these hoses can be made from standard vacuum and heater hoses. The key thing is to take a short section of the old hoses (do not take them apart and you will lose tracks of them, they are like Spaghetti down there!) and go to local auto parts stores and buy them. You can argue soaking the CCV in gasoline to clean it (I used a new CCV) and re-install it (again, only if you are short of budget). The only thing you absolutely need new are: Intake Manifold Gaskets, Throttle Gaskets x 2, and the Rubber Grommets x 2.
    - If you do only the CCV or only the ICV, then no need to remove the Intake Manifold.

    Good Luck and I hope this helps you folks decide what to do when you remove the Intake Manifold for whatever reason!
    -------------
    Bonus: How to rebuild Banjo Fittings? When I closely examine the Oil Line to Vanos, I realize that this is simply Banjo Fittings that are used throughout the car (Vanos, PS High-Pressure Hoses which are very expensive). Then I realize that your garden hose at home works the same way: it has a crimp at the fitting to squeeze the hose against the brass fitting and many times I fixed my leaky garden hose with new fitting and trust-worthy clamps.

    So if you are short of money and want to rebuild any Banjo Hoses, I guess you can, the issue is what type of clamp to use at the Banjo Fitting? Has anyone ever rebuilt the Banjo Fitting on any Hydraulic Hose using new rubber hoses and standard clamps and want to chime in?

    If you need to change the PS high-pressure hoses and short of budget, I guess you can rebuild the hoses, just go to your local hydraulic shops. I can see that a good hydraulic shop can rebuild any hydraulic line for you with their crimping machine (which costs $2K or so): you bring the fittings and hoses and they crimp for you.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kmBRGnSdv_s

    http://www.flexdraulic.com/crimp-fittings.html


    cn90's Bf.c screenname is cnn.
    Last edited by jamesdc4; 09-18-2010 at 07:52 PM.

  2. #2
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    Here's the second DIY.

    http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...d.php?t=923117
    Quote Originally Posted by Jfive96 View Post
    - -Well today I tackled the common CCV (Crankcase Vent/Oil separator) problem. My problem was a very loud intake leak sound and once I placed my finger over the side port on the CCV, the leak went away as best my finger could make it do. Also motor would shack back and forth, lighting in and outside the car would dance to the misfire that the CCV was causing among other things. Here is the new unit: , , , .Here is a view from the front of the car of the old unit , . Just before I started this I asked myself could the CCV be replaced without taking the intake manifold off. The answer is YES It can be replaced with out taking the intak manifolid off. Here are the intake manifold gaskets I bought a while back thinking that they were the problem . On to surgery, first I started with removing the air box from the fender to the throttle body . Once the tubing is removed you can see the 3 bolts that hold the CCV in place on the bracket . As you can see the three bolts are easy to get to. They are 10mm. After disconnecting a couple of pigtails and moving a few lines out of the way for clearance the CCV came out without much fuss , , . Once the old CCV was out, I took these picks to show them both , , the CCV on the left is the new one and the one on the right is the old one. After that it’s just a matter of doing the reverse and making sure you reconnect any lines or pigtails that were disconnected. This is a go time to check all hoses and cables while most of the big boxy items are out of the way. Also check the hose coming from the bottom of the CCV to the oil dipstick to tube. After a while the rubber becomes spongy from the heat build up and if you look inside you can see that the inside of the hose is starting to deteriorate. So it would be best to change it at this time. Here she is all buttoned up back to normal . I was curious to see what the old looked like inside and out, so I took it apart and snapped some shots. I hope this helps anyone out there whom may have the problem I had with a bad CCV(Crankcase/Oil separator). I have more photos and info if anyone needs it. My car now runs and ideals MUCH, MUCH better. When I get to work tomorrow I will have the check engine light cleared and wait to see if it will come back on. I have yet to drive it since the work has been done. Going to fill her up before I go to bed just thought I would go ahead and right this up first. I still hear a very faint air sucking sound but it could just be me and my superman hearing when it comes to this car. I’ll get a second option from one of our techs tomorrow and see if I’m just hearing things. Just a side note, while the CCV was bad I did smell the fuems in the cabin from time to time and my OBC said my gas MPG were 20.9. I thought that was very strange, so I’m going to reset the MPG and the MPH gauges and see wha I get after a few tanks. Here are the pics of the old CCV in its nakedness enjoy. , , , , , , , , , , . If I missed anything let me know. Here is the link to a thread that helped me out http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=214052. Thank you. Peace.
    Last edited by jamesdc4; 09-18-2010 at 07:48 PM.

  3. #3
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    No M54 love?

  4. #4
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    A bit of a bump, but, I have to replace the CCV on my 528 with an M52TU engine. As I see there's a big difference in the M52 and M52TU intake manifolds So I guess there's no way around it but to disconnect the intake manifold. So two questions:

    1. Can I get the manifold out of the way without disconnecting the fuel rail, much like in the first guide?

    2. While I'm doing the CCV, what other things should I replace besides the CCV? My best guess is that my manifold gaskets are done for after 155k miles, at least I doubt anybody replaced them midterm. What else could do with replacing? Any hoses? What can I replace on a budget, or is it best to not cheapskate around this or I'll be demolishing this again?

    3. Is it as hard as it looks? I'm guessing on a scale 1-10, 1 is replacing a bulb, 10 is an engine rebuild, this looks like a 6.
    Last edited by MehMan; 06-01-2010 at 02:33 PM.

  5. #5
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    Anybody? I've scouted around a bit, and as far as I can tell, you can reach the CCV if you remove the throttle body, but I wasn't able to pull it out because the hose that leads to the vanos cover was in the way. Any tips here? or is there just no way but to get it out the old fashioned way?

  6. #6
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    Time for me to change the CCV.
    Live the e39..!!


  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by MehMan View Post
    A bit ofe's no way around it but to disconnect the intake manifold. So two questions:
    1. Can I get the manifold out of the way without disconnecting the fuel rail, much like in the first guide on a budget, or is it best to not cheapskate around this or I'll be demolishing this again
    The fuel rail can just sit out of the way on the engine. You should change the coolant hoses near the back of the manifold. They are the weakest link in the cooling IMO. Manifold gaskets are prolly the least of your probs so just check them first.

    Its a piece of cake, I swapped in my m50 manifold in a few hours.

  8. #8
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    What kind of warning signs does the ccv give you when its going or gone bad?

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by jason5driver View Post
    no m54 love?
    ditto

  10. #10
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    have a small oil leak. Hard to diagnose if if its either the CCV or Oil filter housing Gasket (OFHG) because the leak is between the two on my E39. The leak starts between CCV and OFHG and reaches the oil pan but its not the oil pan. I did the CCV test with oil cap no noise or major air pull when you put a plastic bag on it. Its my e39 2003 with 130K.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by fernanm View Post
    have a small oil leak. Hard to diagnose if if its either the CCV or Oil filter housing Gasket (OFHG) because the leak is between the two on my E39. The leak starts between CCV and OFHG and reaches the oil pan but its not the oil pan. I did the CCV test with oil cap no noise or major air pull when you put a plastic bag on it. Its my e39 2003 with 130K.
    Is this how you check the CCV?

    1970 Morris Cooper * 1973 Mini Clubman 1275GT * 2008 BMW 135i Coupe 2008 BMW 128i Cabriolet * 1995 BMW M3

  12. #12
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    Great diy. I just finished replacing the seperator on my 98 328i without removing the intake. I got it to exit the front. Thank you for contributing.
    Last edited by mike318; 11-23-2015 at 10:16 AM.

  13. #13
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    One suggestion, do not use the knockoff ccv valves! For the most part they are completely worthless and will cause you to replace it over and over until you buy a oem one.

  14. #14
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    hi james im going to do mine too. does the ccv come out easily

    - - - Updated - - -

    also are there only two hoses one at front and one at bottom of the pcv to remove?

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