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Thread: Suspension Overhaul FAQ

  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haris View Post
    I don't have OE shocks to send back to you for a core charge though, otherwise it sounds great.
    it's not usually worth it to try and find a set of cores to send back to me. just better to pay the core charge and forget about it...let me hunt down the replacements. besides after you get your billies off and your konis in you can easily sell the billies to someone that only drives on glass.

    if you had your billies revalved there is no guarantee that you will like the revalve...I see this in motorcycle suspension all the time. but it won't turn to crap over time. true, the fluid does get old and it is a nice refresh to change in new fluid but it's a pretty subtle change.

    -E
    Eric Paul Eviston - 1 Piece Silicone Hose M50 Manifold Conversion Kit

    ******M50 Manifold Install Trouble Shooting Guide Here: www.m50manifold.com

    '98 M3/4 - ECIS CAI, S50 Manifold, Conforti Software, 16" Spal Puller, UUC Pulleys, Fan Delete, UUC Stage 2 Fly w/M5 Clutch, UUC Blacks w/TMEs, X-Brace, GC RTAB shims, GC RSMs,
    M Roadster lever, 245x40x17 all 4 corners, Drilled Zimmermans, Motul RBF600 and Redline Synth fluids.
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  2. #52
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    98 M3 Alpineweiss 2/
    I had another idea. I know that the H&R race are overly stiff for their size, would it improve the ride quality significantly if I got H&R Sports or a different spring?

  3. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haris View Post
    I had another idea. I know that the H&R race are overly stiff for their size, would it improve the ride quality significantly if I got H&R Sports or a different spring?
    not significantly. the springs pretty much support the weight of the car and provide for the rebound force. the shocks are whats causing 90% of your ride quality.

    -E
    Eric Paul Eviston - 1 Piece Silicone Hose M50 Manifold Conversion Kit

    ******M50 Manifold Install Trouble Shooting Guide Here: www.m50manifold.com

    '98 M3/4 - ECIS CAI, S50 Manifold, Conforti Software, 16" Spal Puller, UUC Pulleys, Fan Delete, UUC Stage 2 Fly w/M5 Clutch, UUC Blacks w/TMEs, X-Brace, GC RTAB shims, GC RSMs,
    M Roadster lever, 245x40x17 all 4 corners, Drilled Zimmermans, Motul RBF600 and Redline Synth fluids.
    My Dyno HERE
    My Website:
    www.m50manifold.com
    My Email:
    info@m50manifold.com


  4. #54
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    i can haz wheelz
    I installed dust sleeves on my rear shocks when I installed new ones, they looked like this:



    However, I seemed to have done it incorrectly as they are now mangled -- it's like the bump stop slammed in to them and destroyed them. When assembling the rear shocks, does the bumpstop go at the bottom and then the dust boot sits "on top"? Or do I actually make the bumpstop fit inside the cover before I bolt everything up?

    This is the first time I've done this, as you can see
    Last edited by numbah9; 11-18-2009 at 03:34 PM.

  5. #55
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    1994 318is; 2001 525i
    Just replaced my rear shocks and springs for the first time. The bumper stop goes on top of the dust cover. The bottom "pointed" part of the bumper stop should "click" into the top of the dust cover which has the two rings. Do this before you slide them on the shock, and then mount the rest of the components, and remount the shock to the car. You will of course have to remove the shock to do all this, but that wasn't that hard to begin with. Just a pain in the ass. Good luck.

  6. #56
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    i can haz wheelz
    Quote Originally Posted by shlalaw View Post
    Just replaced my rear shocks and springs for the first time. The bumper stop goes on top of the dust cover. The bottom "pointed" part of the bumper stop should "click" into the top of the dust cover which has the two rings. Do this before you slide them on the shock, and then mount the rest of the components, and remount the shock to the car. You will of course have to remove the shock to do all this, but that wasn't that hard to begin with. Just a pain in the ass. Good luck.
    Thanks. I ended up doing this -- the biggest pain is removing the nuts from the shock towers.. ugh!

  7. #57
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    Ok great. Thanks very much Spoonman, I really respect your wealth of suspension knowledge. I'll definately be getting the reinforcement plates. I saw those blue ones, apparently they are thicker/stronger than regular plates? I live in Canada and shipping is a pain so I'll have to figure that one out.

    Stupid question...do the plates go between the RSM and the gasket? I haven't actually taken a look yet...

  8. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1604169 View Post
    Ok great. Thanks very much Spoonman, I really respect your wealth of suspension knowledge. I'll definately be getting the reinforcement plates. I saw those blue ones, apparently they are thicker/stronger than regular plates? I live in Canada and shipping is a pain so I'll have to figure that one out.

    Stupid question...do the plates go between the RSM and the gasket? I haven't actually taken a look yet...
    Call Turner and discuss shipping, they're good people.

    Plates go on top of the shock mount, under the carpet in the trunk. The rear shock shaft is stacked in the order: Bump stop, sleeve, washer, bushing, washer, lock nut (refer to your RSM directions for exact stack order). This is assembled then inserted from below, the RSM's studs will poke through the holes in the trunk, and the plate goes between the shock mount sheet metal and the locknuts. Turner's page shows it wonderfully. It will also make more sense once you see it in person.
    "I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me." - Hunter S. Thompson
    Suspension Overhaul FAQ

  9. #59
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    Ya that make sense... I should have thought that through before posting.
    Last edited by shogun; 01-14-2016 at 08:41 PM.

  10. #60
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    santro
    Why does the H&R Sport behave like crap with Bilstein Sports, but much more civilized with Konis?


    I was getting ready to purchase the H&R sport springs and the Bilstein sport shocks for my 95 325i vert but now I am re-thinking this based upon your post (well-written by the way) and this particularly quoted comment.

    Could you enlighten me just a bit more about this combination? I am a pretty regular reader of these posts but have not really heard about this. turbocharger

  11. #61
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    Guide Update
    I have inserted the first of several tech articles, this one focusing on tires. If you don't have a good working understanding of tires then you should give it a once over. They are a very critical and often under-appreciated part of the system.


    Quote Originally Posted by berzina123 View Post
    Why does the H&R Sport behave like crap with Bilstein Sports, but much more civilized with Konis?
    That is only in the M3 application, and it has everything to do with the shock valving. If you are purchasing standard 3-series Bilstein shocks and not M3 variants, the H&R+Bilstein combo should be perfectly fine.
    "I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me." - Hunter S. Thompson
    Suspension Overhaul FAQ

  12. #62
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    Hey im still confused,

    Im about to replace whole front suspension control arms/spindles and was looking was looking at GC and on their site it shows a Upper Inner Bearing(pair) and Lower Inner Bearing(pair).

    Now are they talking about the two balljoints on the control arm per side? I wanted to make sure first before I buy, with those and the powerflex fcabs polyurethane are what Im going with if what I thought is right..

  13. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by NicoyAKinG View Post
    Im about to replace whole front suspension control arms/spindles and was looking was looking at GC and on their site it shows a Upper Inner Bearing(pair) and Lower Inner Bearing(pair).

    Now are they talking about the two balljoints on the control arm per side? I wanted to make sure first before I buy, with those and the powerflex fcabs polyurethane are what Im going with if what I thought is right..
    Nothing wrong with powerflex.

    I would assume they mean the ball joints, yes. Better find out for sure though, people refer to things in funny ways sometimes. Why would you replace your spindles?
    "I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me." - Hunter S. Thompson
    Suspension Overhaul FAQ

  14. #64
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    Yeah I will call to ask, I think Im going with their sway bar kit too anyways. Well here is what they look like;
    lower

    upper



    And I hit a curb and it started making a whinding noise when driving so I thought it was the wheel bearings so I replaced the hub/bearings on both front to be even but the noise is still there. So Im thinking it could be that the spindle is scored or something because when I replaced the hub/bearing with just the hub assembly mounted it still made noise as i spinned it.

    Im doing a complete suspension overhaul so I might as well replace it too you know..

  15. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by NicoyAKinG View Post
    lower

    upper
    I'm fairly certain that those are designed for the inner side (subframe mount) of the stock upper control arm and lower camber arm in the rear.


    And I hit a curb and it started making a whinding noise when driving so I thought it was the wheel bearings so I replaced the hub/bearings on both front to be even but the noise is still there. So Im thinking it could be that the spindle is scored or something because when I replaced the hub/bearing with just the hub assembly mounted it still made noise as i spinned it.

    Im doing a complete suspension overhaul so I might as well replace it too you know..
    Fair enough. I'd keep the old ones though, just in case it doesn't solve the problem you can make some money back.
    "I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me." - Hunter S. Thompson
    Suspension Overhaul FAQ

  16. #66
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    '93 325is
    I had the rear subframe mounts tear (just the front two, the rear seem ok) Currently the car is sitting waiting for me to have funds to pay a fab guy to repair. While i have the entire rear end torn apart I replaced the four subframe mounts with powerflex and the differential bushings with turners aluminum/delrin kit. I had just done the RTABS in powerflex a few hundred miles ago. I will be ordering some adjustable lower arms to replace the salad tongs as well.

    So if anyone has any questions feel free to ask, I have replaced just about everything on the rear one can and have plenty of pictures and while the car is still apart can take many more pictures if someone wants to see something specific. I'm hoping in the next few weeks the welding will start and I can start putting the car back together.

  17. #67
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    I've been hearing the common thunking and clunking around in the rear so I checked my RSMs. They seem to be intact and don't show any signs of wear. I checked my records and the PO had them replaced about 30K ago.

    What else could this sound be? Maybe I'm inspecting them incorrectly? I've just pulled back the carpet and done a quick visual.
    Perry

  18. #68
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    e36 318i turbo td05
    i need info on the camber shim kits you can buy, ive recently bought one and it didnt come with fitting instructions and need help to put them on, i have the basic idea that they fit on the lower strut mount but dont know if you put the washers or shims on together or seperatley and dont want to put it on wrongly. Any help with photo even would be great

    thanks

  19. #69
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    Hehe... I just cheated and stuck 1 ~2mm thick washer over the bolts, between the strut and the steering knuckle. I know it's not the best, but it definitely added more front end bite in the slow tight mountain road corners. Visually, I'd guess it added 1-1.5 degrees of negative camber.

  20. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1604169 View Post
    I've been hearing the common thunking and clunking around in the rear so I checked my RSMs. They seem to be intact and don't show any signs of wear. I checked my records and the PO had them replaced about 30K ago.

    What else could this sound be? Maybe I'm inspecting them incorrectly? I've just pulled back the carpet and done a quick visual.
    its best to take them out and do a visual that way, look for any tears or cracks in the rubber, i would also change the dodgy bolts that they come with, i had my mounts strip the nuts so you couldnt tighten them properly. so i ended up putting larger bolts and lock nuts on them. added with a rear strut bar new upper shock mounts/shocks and reinforcement plates my rear end is all good now.

    anymore info on where to put these shims, looking at the photo in the first page i see where the washers go but what about the shims where do they go?

  21. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by inked666e36 View Post
    anymore info on where to put these shims, looking at the photo in the first page i see where the washers go but what about the shims where do they go?
    The strut mounts to the steering knuckle using two bolts per side [31311136465 - item 3 in the diagram] that comes with a washer permanently affixed and coated with threadlocker. These are specced for replacement every time they are removed. You can add washers between the strut tabs and the knuckle at the bottom two bolts which will angle the wheel inwards at the top (more negative camber). It will rotate on the top bolt (item 5) which functions as the pivot point around the knuckle.

    I've doctored this image to show where the shims go. The black arrow at the bottom. They go BETWEEN the knuckle and the strut on both bottom bolts.


    This is a half-ass solution to getting more camber, plates are the way it should be done if possible. However, for a low negative camber simple solution it works fine and there is nothing specifically 'wrong' with it. You should limit the thickness of additional washers you put here. It messes with the angle of the bolt to knuckle interaction. It can also make it difficult to fit larger tires/wheels, as it pushes the top inside of the wheel closer to the strut body. You can also run out of safe engagement threading on the bolts, as they are not especially long:




    Edit: The image from joenationwide's alignment thread shows it better:



    This might be the most complete post ever on something so simple…
    Last edited by Evil Spoonman; 01-12-2010 at 03:05 AM.
    "I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me." - Hunter S. Thompson
    Suspension Overhaul FAQ

  22. #72
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    sweet, thanks for that ,

    the kit i bought comes with longer bolts so its not putting strain on the shorter bolts in your photo, but it does look like a half ass way of doing it, ill be adding strut top plates in future, this is just a test to see if more camber at front will be felt at the drivers end of things, ( if you know what i mean) hopefully its a simple worth while mod.

  23. #73
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    Just to complete the info on the shims - if you bought the kit from Bimmer World the washers go under the head of the bolts (which are longer than the stock ones to make up for the shims that you're adding). I have a write up for this kit here: http://www.eabjr.com/Camber-Shims.php

    You will find that the shims are indeed a poor man's way of getting some negative camber, but the amount you get is not as much as you would hope. As you increase the space between the hub assembly and strut, it doesn't all go toward angling the hub outwards; you will also see that the strut also angles a bit inward, which negates some of the effect. But it's a lot easier (and cheaper) than adjustable camber plates!
    Last edited by ChipB; 01-12-2010 at 05:17 PM.

  24. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChipB View Post
    Just to complete the info on the shims - if you bought the kit from Bimmer World the washers go under the head of the bolts (which are longer than the stock ones to make up for the shims that you're adding). I have a write up for this kit here: http://www.eabjr.com/Camber-Shims.php

    You will find that the shims are indeed a poor man's way of getting some negative camber, but the amount you get is not as much as you would hope. As you increase the space between the hub assembly and strut, it doesn't all go toward angling the hub outwards; you will also see that the strut also angles a bit inward, which negates some of the effect. But it's a lot easier (and cheaper) than adjustable camber plates!
    i wish i read this post last night, as this morning i attempted to add the shims and washers to the struts, what a nightmare a 10 minute job ended up taking 2 hours as i couldnt line up the bolts after taking it all apart, what did i do wrong? haha i jacked up one side of the car , i ended up getting one bolt in, limping it down 10km away to my work shop hoist (at this point stressing the one bolt i had in would snap sending the car into a gutter) anyway on the hoist it took more time to take the wheels off then to add the shims i ended up finding 2 more washers and putting them in with the shims to get more camber as the shims themselves did not do alot on their own, but adding washers to the shims did plenty, it looks like i got as much out of the front as i did in the back, hopefully its safe. One tip i will add is to use locktite or tread locker to the bolts so they dont come loose.

    end result is a car i can point and steer into any corner that i would have trouble steering into before, so far so good i like,

    now ill get proper camber plates and coil overs :P

    thanks for your help guys
    Last edited by inked666e36; 01-13-2010 at 03:26 AM.

  25. #75
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    Worth noting that the key to getting these lower strut bolts loose is heat. The threadlocker is nullified by a short time under the torch (you want MAPP gas or better, propane will hardly be hot enough) and they break free quite easily. Penetrating oil helps if they are also cemented by corrosion, generally I find that not to be the case, though.

    Also you cannot fully trust that the tire will not contact the strut body if it is close when you finish. Tires can never be thought of as static entities. They deform in all kinds of ways nary understood by science (tires are black magic). It is very possible for a tire to deform under a certain load condition/temperature in a way that pushes the top inwards and causes rub. Monitor your strut housing after the modification for signs of rubbing.

    ^ Awesome writeup, as always, Spoonman!
    I aim to please...
    Last edited by Evil Spoonman; 01-13-2010 at 08:18 AM.
    "I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me." - Hunter S. Thompson
    Suspension Overhaul FAQ

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