Team bimmerforums E30 section Lemons build

[moberg12]

so what your saying my auto with its 4:10 lsd would be great on a short track? lol

no auto= fail

eta 170 tq x 3.73 = 634.1

i motor 164 tq x 4.10 = 672.4

Why that might seem like an a$$ kicking to the eta, a stock i motor with 3.73 = 611.72

So Jim the eta with a 3.73 will pull harder than your Spec E30 out of the corners!!

If we can be fast in, fast out all weekend we win!!

[VacMan]

no auto= fail

eta 170 tq x 3.73 = 634.1

i motor 164 tq x 4.10 = 672.4

Why that might seem like an a$$ kicking to the eta, a stock i motor with 3.73 = 611.72

So Jim the eta with a 3.73 will pull harder than your Spec E30 out of the corners!!

At peak torque maybe, but the flexibility of the I powerband gives it huge advantage in real world conditions. Pulling hard to 6500>falling on face at 4000

[moberg12]

At peak torque maybe, but the flexibility of the I powerband gives it huge advantage in real world conditions. Pulling hard to 6500>falling on face at 4000

but knowing the track I don't see the advantages of an i motor in this scenario.

We come out of 14 for the longest straight. 14 is a third gear turn, and even if we hit 5th with the eta motor, everything will be about exit speed out of 14. Then we are down to a 2nd gear tire chicane right before a right turn that you would take in 3rd gear. You would hold 3rd through the next turn then shift to 4th briefly before shifting back to 3rd for 11. Now Jim this is where the eta and 3.73 will shine, they run the old CMP not the sweeping full throttle into 14 that you are use to.

m20b25 matched to a 4.10 is obviously the best choice, but guaranteed to get us crushed!!

[thejlevie]

To the best of my knowledge, they didn't include the chicane this past race. I sure didn't see it in the live cast.

Yes, T14 is a third gear turn, but in my experience on the short course in a Spec E30 the right turn off the main straight is a 3rd gear turn and you hit 4th a bit after entering the back straight. From T11 through T14 it is just like when running the full course. It doesn't matter whether the old or new section after T11 is used. The way I see it, from T11 to the cut off on the front straight you run it just as if you were running the full course (in either new or old mode). Your speed at T14 is a bit higher using the new course, but I don't remember it being a lot higher than the old course.

From everything I've read about the cars picked as the People's Curse, those are the cars that earned that reward by behavior on track, not just because the car happened to be fast. Basically if you make other competitors mad by your behavior on track you can expect to get crushed. That can be from overly aggressive driving that results in contact, running competitors off track, blocking, not being able to manage traffic & poor situational awareness, etc., seems the fast way to get crushed. That's why I suggest race experience be a requirement for most of the drivers. Well, that or DE experience where open passing is the rule.

[moberg12]

either way there are enough motors and rear ends in the mix we can run what ever we choose

[thejlevie]

no auto= fail

eta 170 tq x 3.73 = 634.1

i motor 164 tq x 4.10 = 672.4

Why that might seem like an a$$ kicking to the eta, a stock i motor with 3.73 = 611.72

So Jim the eta with a 3.73 will pull harder than your Spec E30 out of the corners!!

If we can be fast in, fast out all weekend we win!!

Those are peak numbers. What is more important is the area under the torque curve. I don't have representative dyno plots for for both engines to compare, but I think the wider power band of an i engine (albeit with a slightly lower peak tq) will beat an eta.

[moberg12]

yeah I agree, but obviously peak torque numbers are going to come at a lot lower RPM's than an i motor

[kishg]

why do we think an m20b25 with 4.10 will get us crushed? i think if we race clean, we should be fine. i don't know enough about CMP to comment on gearing right now. Going to look for video of people running the West course. I believe that's what they run for LeMons? Traqmate data would be ideal!

[az3579]

Maybe I'm lagging in the eta vs i discussion here, but being at a DE just yesterday, I can attest to the fact that an eta just doesn't have enough revs. Depending on the course, you'll have to shift a lot. Many times I found myself having to upshift just a bit before a corner because I was running out of revs, and then had to downshift again to make the corner. It just isn't efficient. And, I have a 2.93 LSD, so I can't imagine a 3.73...

[thejlevie]

That is what I'd expect from an eta engine. It was designed with the idea of economy in street driving in mind, not performance.

[M3Bill]

If there is still room for a driver, I'm in.

[thejlevie]

I didn't start this mad project, but you have my vote for a position on the team!

[pennpen]

i think they said the buy in for a driver is $400, crew (like me hopefully) is $75 or $30 if your cheeky

[M3Bill]

I didn't start this mad project, but you have my vote for a position on the team!

Thanks for the vote of confidence, Jim!

[moberg12]

The entry fee for a team of 6 is $1100 or about $183 a person.

That does not include the cost of building the car, spares, tires, brakes, Fuel.....

$400 was an estimate it might be more

[thejlevie]

Thanks for the vote of confidence, Jim!

Well, demonstrated abilities count for something!

As an FYI to other readers, After two races, Bill and I hold 2nd overall and 2nd in class in the NASA-SE Enduro series. Our pit crew has been a big help (a big thanks to Greg, his dad, and everyone else).

[moberg12]

Well, demonstrated abilities count for something!

As an FYI to other readers, After two races, Bill and I hold 2nd overall and 2nd in class in the NASA-SE Enduro series. Our pit crew has been a big help (a big thanks to Greg, his dad, and everyone else).

Go team Pit-stop

[moberg12]

Possible donor

http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1209836

More info: 5 speed and the engine is in pieces.

[kishg]

bill, I don't know you but if Jim and Greg vouch for you, your good to go in my book!
also, the costs will probably be more than $400. we'll need to work that out based on which way we decide to go vis a vis donor car etc and the cost of bringing it upto spec.

[NHskibm]

Hey guys.. still trying to make my schedule work with pete to take a really good look at the car...

his family owns a shop so I'm going to try to get him to meet me there so we can throw it on a lift...

Last I heard from him $300 if he can pull a couple parts... I still have a bunch of crap in the basement so as far as I am concerned he can pull whatever he wants.. the cheaper the better...

I'm going to take a hard look at all the critical points on the car.. frame rails of course but then bushings and such - i.e. where rear control arms meet subframe, etc.

Often here in the NE the biggest issue is the fenders, bottom of doors, and then behind the rear wheels... I call them the "four corners"...

But again, I've actually seen this car before and it was pretty damn clean... don't freak out THAT much about a NE car.. They aren't THAT bad!!! :P

I'll keep you posted... I really want to try to look at it early this week so I could potentially relay it to Kish next Sat morning...

[kishg]

Hey guys.. still trying to make my schedule work with pete to take a really good look at the car...

his family owns a shop so I'm going to try to get him to meet me there so we can throw it on a lift...

Last I heard from him $300 if he can pull a couple parts... I still have a bunch of crap in the basement so as far as I am concerned he can pull whatever he wants.. the cheaper the better...

I'm going to take a hard look at all the critical points on the car.. frame rails of course but then bushings and such - i.e. where rear control arms meet subframe, etc.

Often here in the NE the biggest issue is the fenders, bottom of doors, and then behind the rear wheels... I call them the "four corners"...

But again, I've actually seen this car before and it was pretty damn clean... don't freak out THAT much about a NE car.. They aren't THAT bad!!! :P

I'll keep you posted... I really want to try to look at it early this week so I could potentially relay it to Kish next Sat morning...

sounds good. let us know howard. tks for putting in the legwork.

[moberg12]

Got the pics from the seller of our other possible donor:

[Shadow86325e]

I'd donate my car if I had a second e30, though I'd hate to throw it into a race like the lemons because of the time and dedication I put into it myself. Namely the engine and the new parts I put on it are what I value the most D: But other that that, crap paint and some exterior damage would qualify as a lemons car.

Also I'm too far away :S


Another note, this should be on the hood as the logo for team bimmerforums:




Also I agree that the eta engine should be used for the race, it's not like you're going to be averaging 115+ in this race. Most of the cars in the race will probably barely climb over 50. an ETA engine will go 80-90 easy at ages most other cars will choke at. The eta engine is also damn near indestructable, cheap, reliable, and has tons of torque at much lower RPMs than an i engine. Kinda like a diesel. Isn't low-end torque a little better to have on a race like this? I don't race so I wouldn't know. But the gas mileage of the eta may also give you a leg-up on pit stops.

[az3579]

But the gas mileage of the eta may also give you a leg-up on pit stops.

I'd have to agree on this one though. I averaged about 15mpg on the track, which is frickin' amazing.
No power of course, but no pit stops all day.


What kind of a course is it? Is there a map?

[thejlevie]

The next race in the southeast will be at CMP. You never how the organizers will set up the track, but this last race used the west course (see http://www.carolinamotorsportspark.com/trackmap.html)