i have deleted the e30 power steering like a year ago, and with the prices of the 3 hoses on the e36, i figure i may try to go with this unit below, a guy from e30tech has made a product out of it and selling them for the e36 and e30, he says they fit both. curious if anyone has tried one on there e36 yet?
http://www.e30tech.com/forum/showthr...light=steering
he made a small website now,
http://www.powersteeringdeletes.com/
and i thought the power steering on my e36 was overly heavy to begin with.. i can only imagine the car without :x
'96 328is 5speed - CDV Delete, SPAL electric fan with SPAL PWM controller, weight reduction, Koni str.t springs, H&R OE sport springs, 16" Kosei K1's, ECIS CAI, bored out cupholders.. etc
Sold 04/27/10 - Now rockin' a 1996 200sx SE-R.
I just paid about 800 Bucks to redo my whole Power Steering system cause it was out! You must have HUGE Popeye like arms to muscle the car around! It was heavy to the point it was dangerous in my opinion.
old thread, but I lost my ps this weekend at the track (something went inside the rack, no leaks and plenty of pressure from the pump) and while the feel in the pits sucked, I loved the amount of feedback on track. I've started looking for a thread on doing a delete. The E30 guys said it's common on those cars, so I'm interested if there is a good delete for the E36. I'm told that doing the delete (on the E30) is different from dealing with a rack internal seal failure. I haven't done any research so if I'm off base let me know. If anybody knows of a thread or pluses and minuses, I'd be interested.
'97 328i - 244,000 mls
'94 325is - NASA Spec3 Build in progress
'02 F350 - tow vehicle
The E30 guys will tell you it rocks, and go ahead and delete it.
Well, "your mileage will vary". The basic E30 design was developed with much less castor than the E36, and this was in part because a fairly large # of E30 cars may have been delivered with manual racks. Grandma had to be able to steer it.
On the flip side, the vast majority of the E36s were designed predicated on the assumption that they would have power steering...so more castor was put in, for better straight line self centering...but at that point, you are likely to prefer the power steering's assist. Grandma may not be too happy in the very, very few manual racked E36's out there.
I tracked down one of those racks, set up my race car with it, and moved on. Too tough with monster slicks for my taste. It is telling that even at the pro level when PTG ran the E36, they uniformly retained PS....
So, listen to the E30 crowd with a bit of doubt on this issue as their experience may not translate well to the E36 chassis.
(If I've got it wrong, go ahead and correct me)
Alex Lipowich
xyobgyn on AOL
Trying to make the world a better place with 5 extra throttle bodies at a time.
Don't the E30's also just fill the steering end with fluid and connect the
2 hoses together? That's a small bit of easy plumbing to try, and if you hate
it, you're not out much...
t
hi guys,
I design and sell the powersteering delete plates. My site is currently down at the moment. These work on a stock e36 and M3 rack. As previously mentioned, the steering will be harder at very low speeds, but anything over 10mph, and you really begin to notice the increase in sensitivity and you get much more feedback. I have an e36 rack on my e30, and I love how responsive it is with no ps. Its not for everyone, but if someone wants to give it a shot, i'll send one your way free of charge, as long as you take some good pics of the install, and write a review.
Is it possible to take the fuse for the power steering out just to get a 'feel' for what it'd be like to run around without it? This seems like a good way to get a teaser before you go in there and change up the hardware.
Out of curiosity, does anyone know how much the power steering assemply weighs? How much weight would you save by deleting it?
Unfortunately it doesn't work that way. The only "easy" way to test your car without power steering is to pull the belt off, and even doing that is not an accurate reflection of a car with no power steering because there is still fluid in the rack and lines which you are now manually "forcing/pumping" through the rack.
^ Thanks, that clears that up!
I'll chime in with my 2 cents here as well,..
I decided to depower my PS rack in my 94' 318is (m42 engine). I completely removed the snap rings, pinion shaft, rack, seals, etc - drained all of the fluid from it, greased everything up and re-assembled. I welded both bolts up where the PS lines used to connect. For future reference, you'll need a 59" belt now that you've removed the PS pump. I purchased a Goodyear 4060592 belt as that was the only one available locally. I've also created a solid aluminum block where the steering guibo used to be so there is no slop/flex in the steering feel.
The 1st day that I drove it .... backing out of the garage was tough. Anything below 40 km/hr (25 mph) and you need to use your arms (feels just like it does when a belt snaps and you lose PS).
HOWEVER,.. above 40 km/hr and the feeling is AMAZING. The feedback, the responsiveness - INSTANT. The car also SNAPS back to center faster then with PS. I can cruise on the highway with a single finger on the wheel for hours and not have the need to use a hand to correct the steering (although I dont do this ).
I'm still undecided if I like it this way or not,... I DO know that my girlfriend would NEVER be able to drive the car this way unless we were already cruising at 40 + km/hr. Any slower and she wouldnt be able to make a turn.
On the plus side,.. I never have to worry about PS leaks - I've free'd up some room under the hood,.. lost a little bit of weight, free'd up a small bit of HP (not noticable), and gotten myself a new belt
For those interested, these deletes are still available in UHMW($35) and Aluminum($50).
Prices include shipping within the continental US. Send paypal to silence8@aol.com
http://www.r3vlimited.com/board/showthread.php?t=130389
I wonder what the difference in nonM vs. M is on this. nonM is 3-4* castor, vs. 7* on an M. Seems like an M would really be a bear when you're going slow.
Interesting though, if I had a race car it'd be non powered.
Race cars are one thing but pleasure cars are a different story. I can tell you from experience that not having power steering SUCKS.
I had an S10 without it and anything below 20 mph was torture. I used to cruise parking lots and park a half mile from the store so I could find a space I could drive through so I didn't have to back out.
The guys at the beginning of this thread are on crack. Especially the guy who says he can cruise with one finger now that he deleted his PS. I ALWAYS cruise with one finger.
Bleed your cooling system http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1709482The ULTIMATE OEM Alarm/Keyless thread http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1792200
You can't compare the steering in an s10 to that of an e30... I have no powersteering in my 318 which I DD, and my track car, and they both are a pleasure to drive. the steering feedback is much more direct and responsive. Yes at lower speeds(-10 mph) they are hard to turn, but its livable.
I can't see this being good for a daily driver on an E36. The steering is already really heavy.
you can talk all you want about BMW suspension and steering geometry and world famous handling but when you're doing 3mph in a parking lot or pulling out of your driveway its still just 3000lbs on 4 tires and deleting the PS is nasty in those situations no matter what you're driving.
I admit that these situations are a very small part of the total miles I drive every year but I'd rather know I'm going to have a smile on my face from the moment I turn the key to the moment I open the door and climb out.
Bleed your cooling system http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1709482The ULTIMATE OEM Alarm/Keyless thread http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1792200
what is the proper belt to use in a PS delete.. the Goodyear 4060592 are gatorbacks, will they still work?
bumping this.....will that belt work ^?
Bumping this also, what belt works for an m50 e36, my pump took a dump been driving without ps for a month and i dont mind it, parking the thing sucks but the engine feels smoother and less strained and your forearms get toned lol
PO did a PS delete on my car. What can I say... It SUCKS.
I have a new steering pump and a Z3 rack in the garage waiting for me to fix this BS.
The genius who welded the rack cost me the price of a the new rack plus the core.
It is annoying to drive the this way.
97 BMW M3 (s52b32) - VF-Supercharger kit ( Vortech V2-SQ supercharger, 32 pound injectors, VF tuning ), VDO/LeatherZ Gauge Kit (Oil Temp, Oil Pressure, and Boost), UUC Motorwerks RSC36 Exhaust, Stainless Steel 6-2 Exhaust Headers, Bilstein Sports, Rear Adjustable Camber bushings, Wheel Spacers 10mm in front 25mm in back, Uprated Clutch, UUC Shift Knob, Short Shifter and Clutch Stop, Cross Brace, Mason Engineering front strut bar, Contour Wheels, Euro Ellipsoid (Angel Eyes) HID Headlights, braided steel brake lines, aluminum thermostat housing, mishimoto aluminum radiator and silicone hoses and a partridge in a pear tree
Depends on what tensioner setup you have, but when a friends hose went out on a road trip we figured out how to find a 56" belt in the same number of ribs and it worked fine for well over a couple thousand miles.
I will say if you have any modifications to the suspension, don't delete it. An e30 is also lighter in the front, and even then I don't like it on e30's either.
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