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Thread: Vapor Barrier - What's the specific/ideal adhesive for repair?

  1. #1
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    Vapor Barrier - What's the specific/ideal adhesive for repair?

    I took apart both rear doors today. Easy, use a plastic spatula to help pull door panel off it's plastic rivots after you first remove the wood trim, screw under the inner door handle etc.

    Pep Boys had the 3M Weatherstrip Adhesive in Black here:

    http://www.shop3m.com/70070385854.html

    Or the same thing in Yellow here:

    http://www.3m.com/Product/informatio...-Adhesive.html

    But my local repair shop has this, Black Rubber Silicone Adhesive Sealant:


    http://www.crazypc.com/products/93460.html


    Specifically, what have you used to fix the infamous 'Water in the Rear Floor Syndrome'?

    I cannot have another ounce of water in my car, ever. Thank you.
    "I'd smash that (Jennifer Connelly) like a failed coup in sub-Saharan Africa."
    ~Macktheknife in my epic Jennifer Connelly OT Thread

  2. #2
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    I would like to know also

    thanks

  3. #3
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    I repaired the driver side rear door with Silicone II Black Window & Door Sealant from Lowes/Home Depot - made by GE. I have not had any leaks since I have done it, and that includes being subjected to the winds and rain from all of the hurricanes we have encountered this year.

    I will be doing the passenger side as it has a slight leak as well. Lately, I have been parking my car outside due to an E24 sitting in my garage. I would have never noticed it until now since I usually garage it overnight, as well as a garage while at work.

  4. #4
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    Silicone II Black Window & Door Sealant from Lowes/Home Depot made by GE...

    ^ thanks for the tip. It's a completely overlooked and specific item to the repair!
    "I'd smash that (Jennifer Connelly) like a failed coup in sub-Saharan Africa."
    ~Macktheknife in my epic Jennifer Connelly OT Thread

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by bimmerfiver View Post
    Silicone II Black Window & Door Sealant from Lowes/Home Depot made by GE...

    ^ thanks for the tip. It's a completely overlooked and specific item to the repair!

    Here is a link to the exact sealant I used (Black): http://www.caulkyourhome.com/sil2_window_door.html
    Last edited by mmm635; 09-28-2008 at 12:16 PM.

  6. #6
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    For starters you do not need to remove any wood trim to remove the door panels. I think the 3M stuff you have listed is the right product. I got mine from the dealer as it's the exact same stuff they use to repair/install new barriers. I don't think they offer it as a part# available but if you ask nicely and tell them what your doing the parts guy might grab some from the techs or could get the box so you can get the 3M part #.

  7. #7
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    I repaired my door seal without new sealant by simply heating up the existing sealant. It took 15 minutes with a hairdryer but you can try that first if your leaking is minimal like mine was. I always check my rear floor after car washes and it's never been wet since. My success doesn't gaurantee yours, however...

  8. #8
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    I bought the sealant from the dealer. The 3M stuff that I saw in autoparts stores made me nervous that it was a little too permanent. You never know when you have to go back into that door (the next time the window regulator breaks).

    Unfortunately, they sell it in 10 meter rolls for about $40. The part # on the box I have is 83190153321. The material is butyl tape.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by adam1979 View Post
    I bought the sealant from the dealer. The 3M stuff that I saw in autoparts stores made me nervous that it was a little too permanent. You never know when you have to go back into that door (the next time the window regulator breaks).

    Unfortunately, they sell it in 10 meter rolls for about $40. The part # on the box I have is 83190153321. The material is butyl tape.
    In my opinion, this thread and others should be pooled together for the DIY Section: Vapor Barrier Repair 101.

    Nice work there with the official part number for the adhesive.
    "I'd smash that (Jennifer Connelly) like a failed coup in sub-Saharan Africa."
    ~Macktheknife in my epic Jennifer Connelly OT Thread

  10. #10
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    your other option would be to put some tussin on that shit.

  11. #11
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    I suggest a search since this has been covered numerous times...
    for me:
    - Reheat did not work, 1 month later, still weeping BUT NO WET FLOOR
    - I removed all old Butyl, installed all new Butyl. lasted around a month with same symptom as above.
    - Bought new vapor barriers, removed butyl AGAIN. Cleaned door frame with autobody paint prepsol. Install new butyl, new vapor barriers. problem solved.

    The vapor barrier can be separated from door frame and most of the time the floor will be dry. IT takes a hard rain, with the vehicle at the right angle to get wet floors.

    The test for a broken seal is..... After a strong rainstorm carefully open the rear door. With your totally dry hand, wipe your hand on the lower door frame between the outside door weatherstrip gasket and the interior door panel. If it is damp in any way, it is leaking and needs to be corrected. After my first fix, I never had wet floors but I had damp/wet lower door panels on both sides. Pulled the door panels off AGAIN and sure enough, the seal was broken in the same place.

  12. #12
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    I took the lazy way and just slapped the new butyl on top of the old where there wasn't much left. I actually did this more as a precautionary measure because I had removed the vapor barrier a few times to play with the window. I never had a damp floor. There is a tiny bit of water dripping out of the bottom of the door if I open it right after a really hard rainstorm, but I have never had water on the carpet.

    I suppose I should fix it right per gtxragtop's suggestion of cleaning everything and starting from scratch, but until I have water on the floor I am not motivated to do that. We have had quite a bit of rain in MA recently, and it hasn't been a problem so I'm not worried.

    How long did it take to clean all that butyl off? It sounds like quite the project (one I don't think I have time for).

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by gtxragtop View Post
    The test for a broken seal is..... After a strong rainstorm carefully open the rear door. With your totally dry hand, wipe your hand on the lower door frame between the outside door weatherstrip gasket and the interior door panel. If it is damp in any way, it is leaking and needs to be corrected. After my first fix, I never had wet floors but I had damp/wet lower door panels on both sides. Pulled the door panels off AGAIN and sure enough, the seal was broken in the same place.
    Gtxragtop, so are your door sills dry after a wash or rain? The black plastic sills that say BMW, ///M or ///M5? I ask because mine have always been wet after a wash and I thought it was normal. I reheated one rear vapor barrier after that side of the rear floor started becoming wet, and it fixed the wet carpet issue. Like I said, I've had wet BMW door sills since I bought the car. Are my vapor barriers leaking, just not enough to wet the carpet?

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by PJB View Post
    Gtxragtop, so are your door sills dry after a wash or rain? The black plastic sills that say BMW, ///M or ///M5? I ask because mine have always been wet after a wash and I thought it was normal.
    Same here

  15. #15
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    Ben Gay and saline solution works wonders.

    Seriously use anything made by 3m.

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  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by PJB View Post
    Gtxragtop, so are your door sills dry after a wash or rain? The black plastic sills that say BMW, ///M or ///M5? I ask because mine have always been wet after a wash and I thought it was normal. I reheated one rear vapor barrier after that side of the rear floor started becoming wet, and it fixed the wet carpet issue. Like I said, I've had wet BMW door sills since I bought the car. Are my vapor barriers leaking, just not enough to wet the carpet?
    Fully dry now since the last fix with the new vapor barriers and new Butyl (that is available at NAPA) Does not matter how much rain or washing with hose. I'm happy once again. Please bear in mind that your floors may not be wet, but they may be getting slightly damp (not to the touch) which creates mildew and rust on floors. Interesting enough, the pass side right rear sill was slightly off color. A bit of brown tinge on the black plastic due to dampness over a long period of time before I bought the car.
    Last edited by gtxragtop; 10-16-2008 at 09:53 PM.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by adam1979 View Post
    I took the lazy way and just slapped the new butyl on top of the old where there wasn't much left. I actually did this more as a precautionary measure because I had removed the vapor barrier a few times to play with the window. I never had a damp floor. There is a tiny bit of water dripping out of the bottom of the door if I open it right after a really hard rainstorm, but I have never had water on the carpet.

    I suppose I should fix it right per gtxragtop's suggestion of cleaning everything and starting from scratch, but until I have water on the floor I am not motivated to do that. We have had quite a bit of rain in MA recently, and it hasn't been a problem so I'm not worried.

    How long did it take to clean all that butyl off? It sounds like quite the project (one I don't think I have time for).
    I took a toothbrush with a fat handle and cut the handle near the end at a 45 degree angle to create a small scraper. I then used this to scrape off most of the old butyl. The plastic does not scratch the paint. To finish, wad up a ball of butyl (with nitral gloves on) and push the wad into the remaining thin layers on the door frame. This will result in removing the thin layer from the door. Keep doing this to remove most of the remaining butyl. Follow up with prepsol on a paper towel. You will need to wet a new paper towel often with the prepsol but it will remove ALL of the butyl and any wax/silicon on the door frame. http://www.performancecoatings.dupon...9295_3919S.pdf

  18. #18
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    You can get Butyl Tape from Napa. Every dealer I have worked at uses Butyl tape

  19. #19
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    Thanks for the update gtxragtop. Now I know my sills and carpet can be fully dry. I'm going to do this in the future.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by PJB View Post
    Thanks for the update gtxragtop. Now I know my sills and carpet can be fully dry. I'm going to do this in the future.
    +1!
    I noticed the floors to be raised a bit from being wet, then drying, thus not adhereing to the chasis any more.

    This thread SHOULD be put into the DIY section...
    Hint, hint....

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jason5driver View Post
    +1!
    I noticed the floors to be raised a bit from being wet, then drying, thus not adhereing to the chasis any more.

    This thread SHOULD be put into the DIY section...
    Hint, hint....
    Maybe Jamie will move it there. lol

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by blacksapphire View Post
    maybe jamie will move it there. Lol

    lmao!!!

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  23. #23
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    I don't have kids so I put some Big Stretch in the gap between the door and the frame. E39 coupe FTW!!!

  24. #24
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    Post #8 made me look into this a bit further.

    I checked different auto parts stores, and asked for their input. I was guided to seek advice from the body shops.
    Throughout this thread there were some remarks on how too permanent the 3M and similar stuff is. That was exactly what I was told by auto body shops.

    Adam1979 (post#8) pretty much nailed it, the downside is the "stealer" markup price. The butyl is NOT permanent, and if you have to repair anything, it is very easy to remove it.

    I found something which I hope is similar. I will use it this week sometimes and I will let you guys know how it works. I found it Auto Value store (Canada) and I have no idea how high the markup price is - I paid 10 bux and change. It is "Pro Form Butyl Tape". It comes in 4 different "flavors":
    5/16"x15' round (PF410)
    5/16"x15' square (PF411)
    3/8"x15' round (PF412)
    and finally 3/8"x15' square (PF413).

    Honestly, I had a hard time finding this product. I do not know how close/similar it is to the OEM stuff, but if it's butyl, it should be similar.
    I just piced the round stuff thinking it might take easier the shape of different spots where the cover of he door molds.
    Attached are the pics. It shows how easy it is to squish it so it molds.
    If this product would be available by forum sponsors,hm,hm,hm - hint,
    I would gladly buy from them.

    Here is the adress on the package if a aponsor would like to do more research and maybe pick the closer to OEM stuff:
    Pro Form Products Ltd.
    604 McGeachie Drive
    Milton,
    Ontario, L9T 3Y5
    Phone:905-878-4990 (1-800-387-7981)

    As for uploading pics - I just cannot for a reason. I always receive the message that the pics are too big (which they are not the biggest is 92 Kb and the smallest is 62 Kb and they are already resized).
    I would gladly receive an uploading lesson from a pic whoring guy - no problem.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by PJB View Post
    I repaired my door seal without new sealant by simply heating up the existing sealant.
    Ditto. Worked great on the wife's e46.
    Garrett

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