HELP! No 5th gear....

[dankwiz]

still not buying the whole over tightened output flange nut.



it is not the job of the flange to hold the bearing in check, that is the job of the output shaft cover, the one with the oil seal in it. personally that's where I think you should be looking, at the output shaft cover.

question, you obviously had to remove the output cover to get to the bearing and the auto shop had to remove it to replace the seal. so my question is, was there a gasket under the cover when you removed it?

I did all of this work myself. When I originally took the output shaft cover off, there was no gasket just rtv sealant, and 5th gear worked fine. I put it back together with rtv and it doesn't work. The flange nut does push on the bearing. Just a thought, when I reassembled it I filled the output seal with grease pretty liberally. Could this have worked into the trans and coated the synchro causing all of this?

[okieflats]

[epmedia]

Maybe a shim got lost? #13 or 15

I been posting pics for a 1983, 240. Is that correct?

click to enlarge
Attachment 512007

[okieflats]

It is a 1983 car with a Getrag 245 transmission in it. Not the original 240. Very similar design at the end though, it appears.

Looks like over tightening the flange nut will push the flange in, along the splines, and push against the inner race of the bearing, which could in turn push the gear forward on the shaft.

[dankwiz]

What do these bolts do? What would happen if they were tightened/loosened? I may have snugged up one of them as I went over snugging up all the case bolts before I reinstalled the trans. I see one is over the selector shaft.
245.jpg

[Tom D]

and there's your problem. I would have to look at an exploded view, but they for sure hold something in check....lightly!

- - - Updated - - -

here you go, some studying for you.

http://www.bmw2002.net/pdf/Getrag245.pdf

[okieflats]

Are those the shift shaft detents? spring pushing on a ball bearing. Trans have things like interlocks, to prevent more than one gear from engaging at a time, and shaft detents for the "click" into gear.

[Tom D]

^ yup! I just went back and looked at the picture and I believe your right! the balls and springs for the shifter detents.

[dankwiz]

It looks like the rear one is on the selector shaft. Maybe by tightening it, I've restricted the 5th gear selector rod and it can't go fully into gear?

[Tom D]

no questions about it.

[okieflats]

That's one hell of a pdf file on trans overhaul. Very detailed. Hard to follow. Suppose it assumes you've done that sort of thing a few times before.

Page labeled 23-36 shows the detents and the springs real well.

page 23-33 talks about disassembly and warns, " Watch Loose Balls!!! " You don't want your (detent) balls getting loose on you.

[dankwiz]

well hopefully i can reach it by just reaching my hand up in the tunnel. ill be back soon with results.

[Tom D]

I wouldn't try, but maybe you can pull it off.

[dankwiz]

well i loosened both of those bolts to no avail. Looks like im going to pull the transmission and crack it open to see whats up.

[Tom D]

you don't want to crack it open if necessary, just study where and how those bolts and the things they hold belong.

[dankwiz]

I finally figured it out.
245.jpg
the bolt circled in purple was in a worn out hole and very loose so I tapped the hole a little deeper to make the shift support a snug fit and used a longer bolt as well. I went ahead and used a longer bolt in the yellow hole as well. The longer bolt in the yellow hole was keeping the shifter from coming back far enough to engage fifth so i put the shorter bolt back in and all is well. What a headache and it was all my fault lol.

[epmedia]

You meaning to tell us it was just the shift support bracket wiggling around that caused all this crap?

Grill some tri-tip and enjoy a couple beers while you're at it please. lol
Oh - begin marinating asap, with pineapple chucks, rice vinegar and whatever spices.

[dankwiz]

Yeah apparently so, good thing I hid the hammers from myself before I found this. I was about ready to start using them.

[Eben Bosman]

Thank you for posting!!!!
I replaced the oil seal on the selector rod and noticed the bolt circled in Yellow in your pic, was missing. I replaced the bolt and had no 5th gear just like you did. Surfed the Net and stumbled onto your post. Shorter bolt and problem solved!

[epmedia]

Thank you for posting!!!!
I replaced the oil seal on the selector rod and noticed the bolt circled in Yellow in your pic, was missing. I replaced the bolt and had no 5th gear just like you did. Surfed the Net and stumbled onto your post. Shorter bolt and problem solved!

Glad you were able to find this thread! and welcome to the forums.