M60 in a Range Rover?

[shupack]

I have a '96 Range Rover with a dead engine, instead of replacing it with another '56 technology lump I'm considering doing a swap.

According to wikipedia, the e31/32 cars used the same transmission with the M70/B50, I'm not sure which trans the M60/B40 engine used but I would assume the same, it has almost 50% more power and 32% more torque than the RR, if it's a reasonable swap it's a no brainer. I would also expect a bit better milage.

I wouldn't sneeze at am M70 but doubt I could find one..

Is it reasonable to assume that swapping the bellhousings is all I would need to mate engine/trans? I can handle the engine mounts, wiring etc..

What should I look for in a donor? what should I shy away from? should I forget about this project? I'll do a full rebuild on the engine before it goes in for the last time, should I be concerend with milage on the block? (I'll research rebuilds later, once I have an engine in-hand).

How are the electronics for mating with another system?

[E36LUVA]

Seeing that the M62 only started being used in the 2002 and up Range Rover it might a bit much trying to swap an M60 into your generation RR. You might consider a motor from these guys instead.

http://www.v8engines.com/engine.htm

These old motors are very tunable, you can bore them, stroke them, just go nuts with them. Good luck.

[burninator]

I think that could be a very cool project.

[shupack]

The question isn't "should I do a swap?" but "which engine is going in?"

I can handle the swap, I'm just looking for info to narrow down my engine choices. I thought about an LSx but nah..

I believe the m60 with it's bellhousing will mate to my transmission (zf hp24), where can I find the info to be sure?

I found an m70 for $900 locally, what are the cances it's in decent shape? Same situation with the trans as best as I can tell.

Where can I find dimensions to check fit? I can hear it now, a v12 RR-bueatiful. probably get worse milage than it does now.

[E36LUVA]

The question is will the trans hold up to the new found power of the M60. I know they are the same externally but are they the same internally you know clutches etc. Your talking about a big difference in power here. I like the way you think though, outside the box, very intriguing. There must be someone out there who has done this.....

[Jonsku]

750 is cheaper than 540 or 740, at least here in europe. If i'd be you, i'd buy whole car and screw of the parts i needed.
You should swap the gearbox also, cardan shaft is easily modified and balanced.

With M70 you can have problems with doubled engine management, so M60 could be easier (and lighter also). V12 has of course "more balls"

[shupack]

my trans is a big ? of wether it will hold up, but swapping the trans too will be a bit of a mess because of the transfer case, not as easy as on a 2wd car.

getting a whole parts-car is definately the way to go, I'd love to have that v12 but can it be made to run stand-alone? I have a friend that's an electronics wizzard, he's willing to help make my gages etc work, it's a '95 so I'm not worried about security other than dis-abling it.

So which years should I look for and which to avoid?

"There must be someone out there who has done this..... "

doubt it, several LSx swaps, never seen a BMW plant in a RR (except the newer ones, before they went to Jag [ford] engines)

[shupack]

allright, hell with it. after reading the "BMW engine into a non bmw car" (canpt post links yet...) thread, I figure there's nothing "reasonable" about my swap at all (I'd been taking cost, gas milage, performace, feasability etc into account)

I'm going with a V12. car-part.com has them from about $1200-4000.

Would I be better off getting a less expensive one and rebuilding, or spend more upfront for a newer/fewer miles? I'm just going to hook it to my existing trans, if it blows it blows. The zfhp24 can handle 300hp from a modded rover engine, if I don't put any goodies on the m-70 that's about what I can expect.

If I have to move the radiator forward or firewall back a little that's no biggie.

suggestions on good places to find an engine or a complete donor car?

[Auraraptor]

I am pretty sure the M62 tranies are 5ZHP24 and 5ZHP30. Best to ask in the 7 and 8 series subforums about the ones used for the M60 and M70.

[Auraraptor]

BTW, after a little searching, your OE 4HP24 is the same unit as was used in the E32 750 and E31 850.

[Jonsku]

getting a whole parts-car is definately the way to go, I'd love to have that v12 but can it be made to run stand-alone? I have a friend that's an electronics wizzard, he's willing to help make my gages etc work, it's a '95 so I'm not worried about security other than dis-abling it.

So which years should I look for and which to avoid?

Buy car older than '95, so you won't have problems with EWS2. Then it's basically the same how old one you buy, of course the very first models may have had some minor problems which are fixed to newer ones, but nothing major i suppose.

If and when you buy V12, the inlet-plenum gaskets are worth replacing. It's a PITA job to do when the engine is in the car.

[shupack]

"BTW, after a little searching, your OE 4HP24 is the same unit as was used in the E32 750 and E31 850"


that's what got me started thinking about a BMW engine, I was looking for trans information for an LSx swap and saw they share, "hmmmmm" me thinks.....

may be more of a PITA, but WAY more exciting than an LSx.

[garretvs]

[IMG]file:///C:/DOCUME%7E1/steve/LOCALS%7E1/Temp/moz-screenshot-4.jpg[/IMG]

Oh, well. Could not directly cut and paste from a .PDF I have of the hp/torque curve from BMW publication "SBT 4.0 Liter V8 Engine - M60" dated 21.08.2004. It shows that the M60B40 makes a whopping:

85hp at 2000rom
155hp at 3000rpm
220hp at 4000rpm

Stay away from the early 90's Alusil engines. Lots of them in junk yards with no compression; hard-coating on the cyl bores reacted chemically with the sulfur-bearing gasoline used in the USA

[shupack]

so would

"engine came from a 91 750il grey market car.''

be an alusil engine?

[garretvs]

Sorry, in the above posts, I confused Alusil with Nickasil. Sorry.

BMW had mondo problems with the M60 engines from their introduction until they went with the Alusil coating in the cylinder bores. I don't know about the V12's, but I would guess that they went with the same manufacturing process across the board at their engine plants. There's lots of info re: Alusil/Nickasil at www.e38.org. Lots of sad stories; BMW had to replace literally thousands of engines in the US market, both 6cyl and 8cyl. In Europe, sulfur content in the gas is much lower, so they had no problem. They did not do their research about conditions here, and it cost them. Alusil was introduced in about '96 or '97 Do A google search.

Also, a good explanation here:

http://www.usautoparts.net/bmw/engines/nikasil.htm

[shupack]

what about the v12? I didn't see anything about it there, and it mentions the 6 and V8.

This engine I'm looking at now is $500 or less, no throttles or computers. Sound like a decent deal? JY's are about $1500 in this area..

[Auraraptor]

what about the v12? I didn't see anything about it there, and it mentions the 6 and V8.

This engine I'm looking at now is $500 or less, no throttles or computers. Sound like a decent deal? JY's are about $1500 in this area..

All BMW V12s are alusil with Al blocks. The only thing you should work about is getting a used engine that was overheated, as the Al would warp.

[shupack]

some great pages, thank you.

are there any tell-tale signs of overheating? with the rover block an overheat= automatic head gasket failure.

[smarkwilson]

Did you end up doing a bmw motor swap i want to put m62 in a p38 pickup conversion