diy: powerflex subframe / sub-frame bushings

[ltw97m3]

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[epj3]

Pink m contours? Hehe

I like my powerflex rear subframe bushings!

[Jrdeamicis]

AHH! The good ole subframe bushing. I forgot to put on protection when heating and hammering out mine and I ended up exploding hot burning rubber all over my self. And that rubber takes forever to get off. It brings me back to the good ole' days.

[pat3022]

good write up, thanks!

[Maj.Malfunction]

You don't need to drop the whole rear end. You can do this by dropping only the cat-back and just disconnecting the control arms from the subframe. Also the input and output bolts on the differential.

This saves you a brake bleed and exhaust removal time.

I've done it this way ^ 3 times with no issues. It's a good 4-5 hour job on the ground infront of your apartment!

[pat3022]

You don't need to drop the whole rear end. You can do this by dropping only the cat-back and just disconnecting the control arms from the subframe. Also the input and output bolts on the differential.

This saves you a brake bleed and exhaust removal time.

I've done it this way ^ 3 times with no issues. It's a good 4-5 hour job on the ground infront of your apartment!


that's what was kinda thinking

[somesnapper]

Can this be done without removing the rear end?

[Theodore]

Can this be done without removing the rear end?


You don't need to drop the whole rear end. You can do this by dropping only the cat-back and just disconnecting the control arms from the subframe. Also the input and output bolts on the differential.

This saves you a brake bleed and exhaust removal time.

I've done it this way ^ 3 times with no issues. It's a good 4-5 hour job on the ground infront of your apartment!
:shifty

[BadBoostedBmwM3]

Sry, but whats the difference between subframe and sub-frame bushings?? Is one the diff bushings?? I hear a lot about people using powerflex bushings, but how are UUC bushings?? I ask, bc I love UUC products. J/W bc Im about to replace my rear bushings and want to know what to get.

Great write-up and Thanks for the DIY.

[99MPower]

no difference.. subframe and sub-frame are the same bushings...

there are 19 bushings in the rear in total if your doing them all..

4 subframe
4 ball joints (upper/lower both sides)
2 rsms
2 rtabs
4 upper/lower both sides inner bushings on wishbone, lower control arms
3 diff bushings (1 front, 2 rear)

uuc bushings/powerflex are VERY close to being the same...

How much do you want to spend on the rear suspension overhaul, there are some good threads and pics I posted recently over on M3F.. as well as here on BFC.. just search for rear suspension overhaul/subframe DIY/etc,etc, and you will find a lot of other threads with pics

[dizzythree]

If you disconnect the ebrake cable before you disconnect the CV shafts and the diff flange, you can still put the car in gear and use that. Not the best alternative, but it works.

[NeilM]

Got to add the the OP's method is incredibly inefficient. There's no reason to drop the entire rear end, open the brake lines, etc., not even if replacing the RTABs as well. Nor is it necessary to set the subframe bushings on fire to remove them.

Neil

[99MPower]

if your doing JUST the subframe bushings, I would have to agree about the whole brake line removal..

I would contend that if your in the rear suspension and doing the subframe bushings in the first place, that you should be doing ALL the bushings in the rear suspension, ball joints, and everything, checking for swaybar tab cracks, etc, etc.. Just doing the subframe bushings is a PITA, why not make use of your time wisely and do everything

[BadBoostedBmwM3]

no difference.. subframe and sub-frame are the same bushings...

there are 19 bushings in the rear in total if your doing them all..

4 subframe
4 ball joints (upper/lower both sides)
2 rsms
2 rtabs
4 upper/lower both sides inner bushings on wishbone, lower control arms
3 diff bushings (1 front, 2 rear)

uuc bushings/powerflex are VERY close to being the same...

How much do you want to spend on the rear suspension overhaul, there are some good threads and pics I posted recently over on M3F.. as well as here on BFC.. just search for rear suspension overhaul/subframe DIY/etc,etc, and you will find a lot of other threads with pics

Thanks, I'll check into it.

[dizzythree]

Nor is it necessary to set the subframe bushings on fire to remove them.

Not necessary, but it's the fastest cheap way to get them out.

[NeilM]

Not necessary, but it's the fastest cheap way to get them out.

You misunderstand. It's only necessary to heat the surrounding subframe loop enough to melt the outermost layer of bushing rubber. At this point the bushings will slide out quite easily, especially if you use a puller as the OP did. They'll also leave behind no rubber residue. You'll know when they're hot enough when you start to see light wisps of smoke. It's much more convenient to push them out when you don't have to plunge your hands into flames.

If however you're looking for entertainment value, or to get rid of that unsightly gorilla hair on your hands and arms, then flaming bushings would certainly be one option.


I would contend that if your in the rear suspension and doing the subframe bushings in the first place, that you should be doing ALL the bushings in the rear suspension, ball joints, and everything, checking for swaybar tab cracks, etc, etc.. Just doing the subframe bushings is a PITA, why not make use of your time wisely and do everything

Yes, by all means do as much as makes sense at the same time. But it's still unnecessary to drop all 500 lbs of miscellaneous ironmongery out onto the ground. The RTABs can as easily be replaced with the rest of the rear suspension, subframe etc. in place, and vice versa.

There's no need to eat the whole cow in one piece.

Neil

[99MPower]

Yes, by all means do as much as makes sense at the same time. But it's still unnecessary to drop all 500 lbs of miscellaneous ironmongery out onto the ground. The RTABs can as easily be replaced with the rest of the rear suspension, subframe etc. in place, and vice versa.

There's no need to eat the whole cow in one piece.

Neil

if you were to do lets say, 13 of those bushings as I did... rsms, rtabs, done, and new spc adjustable arms going in, that you have to remove the wishbone, lower rear trailing arm, trailing arm itself (upper/lower ball joints) and then the subframe.. by that time, its easier to remove the WHOLE thing...

didnt take me very long, no issues, and was easier putting it all back together, instead of forcing the subframe in there with the drive shafts still in the car, trailing arms, etc...

[BadBoostedBmwM3]

if you were to do lets say, 13 of those bushings as I did... rsms, rtabs, done, and new spc adjustable arms going in, that you have to remove the wishbone, lower rear trailing arm, trailing arm itself (upper/lower ball joints) and then the subframe.. by that time, its easier to remove the WHOLE thing...

didnt take me very long, no issues, and was easier putting it all back together, instead of forcing the subframe in there with the drive shafts still in the car, trailing arms, etc...

hey do you have any links to the threads you started?? I searched but maybe I was looking for the wrong name.

-thanks, Ethon

[NeilM]

if you were to do lets say, 13 of those bushings as I did... rsms, rtabs, done, and new spc adjustable arms going in, that you have to remove the wishbone, lower rear trailing arm, trailing arm itself (upper/lower ball joints) and then the subframe.. by that time, its easier to remove the WHOLE thing...

Well, to each his own. It's not necessary to remove the trailing arm from the car for any of those bushing replacements. I am curious about one thing: did you replace the outer upper and lower arm outer ball joints because they were worn, or on a "let's just get it all done basis"? I ask because so far I haven't seen any of these wear out.

Neil

[dizzythree]

Well, to each his own. It's not necessary to remove the trailing arm from the car for any of those bushing replacements. I am curious about one thing: did you replace the outer upper and lower arm outer ball joints because they were worn, or on a "let's just get it all done basis"? I ask because so far I haven't seen any of these wear out.

Neil

Outer ball joints really don't last much longer than OEM RTABs. I could completely rotate mine with almost no force at 132k.

[mball19]

What socket or wrench is required to remove the CV axles? I will be doing this project next week and want to be prepared.

[dizzythree]

What socket or wrench is required to remove the CV axles? I will be doing this project next week and want to be prepared.

E12 Inverse Torx.

[savage217]

Outer ball joints really don't last much longer than OEM RTABs. I could completely rotate mine with almost no force at 132k.

What about the rears? I hear those last quite a long time can anyone chip in? The front will def go out before the rear but just wondering what the ave lifetime for the rears are.

[dizzythree]

What about the rears? I hear those last quite a long time can anyone chip in? The front will def go out before the rear but just wondering what the ave lifetime for the rears are.

I was talking about the rear.... :)

[99MPower]

Well, to each his own. It's not necessary to remove the trailing arm from the car for any of those bushing replacements. I am curious about one thing: did you replace the outer upper and lower arm outer ball joints because they were worn, or on a "let's just get it all done basis"? I ask because so far I haven't seen any of these wear out.

Neil

all 4 ball joints on my car were able to rotate VERY freely at 86K.. the brand new OEM ball joints were almost too stiff to rotate by hand... so yes, they were worn out...

some links to my photobucket and cardomain pages with pics... (photobucket has EVERY picture)

http://s239.photobucket.com/albums/ff273/eagle483/M3/September%20Install%20Stuff/

http://www.cardomain.com/ride/3117111/9

thread with all my work done in september when I was home on leave before leave for Baghdad, Iraq
http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1095902

[BadBoostedBmwM3]

all 4 ball joints on my car were able to rotate VERY freely at 86K.. the brand new OEM ball joints were almost too stiff to rotate by hand... so yes, they were worn out...

some links to my photobucket and cardomain pages with pics... (photobucket has EVERY picture)

http://s239.photobucket.com/albums/ff273/eagle483/M3/September%20Install%20Stuff/

http://www.cardomain.com/ride/3117111/9

thread with all my work done in september when I was home on leave before leave for Baghdad, Iraq
http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1095902


Thanks! BTW, I like the painted moldings. Im going to do that on my Alpine, now. I guess you used OEM ball joints.


your better than this but here i was board


I did that before! But, I said i didn't notice any threads and course I didn't do a great search, so I prolly skipped over it.

[NeilM]

Interesting about the two reports of worn upper and lower ball joints. Mine are in good shape at ~105K, including a large number of track miles. Or at least they were last time I looked — maybe I should look again! Note that turning freely is fine, it's detectable play you don't want.

I did replace one lower ball joint a couple of years back, but that was because the bolt was corroded into it and I had to destroy the joint to extract it.

Neil

[99MPower]

i didnt check THAT closely on the ball joints, as it was one of those, "it's getting replaced no matter what since I'm in there" type of replacements..

the one that was still ok after being pressed out did show play though after 87K