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View Full Version : Replaced Engine mounts - few things that came up...



brianc
12-17-2007, 09:32 PM
It's not as trivial as it seems if you just go from your service manual. I had two service manuals, the pelican manual, and several posts from these forums. I had a few things come up that were not discussed in any of the above.

1. Removed the bottom nuts for the engine mounts. They were 17mm on my 98 M3/4. You can access the nuts through a hole in the control arms using a 6" extension - it gives you a straight shot at the nut. The passenger side needed a deep socket. A normal socket would get stuck underneath a frame section so that I could not back out the bolt (because the back side of the socket would get lodged in between). With the longer socket I could force the socket body alongside the frame section. Don't use an impact socket - it won't fit. You'll see what I mean when you're under there.

http://www.alphazone1.com/pics/engine_mount2.jpg
http://www.alphazone1.com/pics/engine_mount1.jpg

2. Remove the top engine mounts nuts. They're also 17mm. As I saw in other posts the 10" wobble extension is the key. Pick one up at Pep Boys, Autozone, Sears etc... Use it along with a second 10" extension to get to the top engine mount nuts. It's very easy. I used 3/8 drive.
3. The engine needed to be lifted about 2.5" to allow clearance to remove the old mounts. I found I needed to temporarily remove several components to allow the engine to move this much. Many of these steps were not mentioned in the service manual or other posts. I had to disconnect or remove the following parts...
- The hose clamp attaching the end of the tube connecting air mass meter to intake manifold. The one closer to the front of the car. Then remove the tube from the air mass meter so that when the engine is lifted the part is not ripped (since the air mass meter is connected to the engine bay - not the engine).

http://www.alphazone1.com/pics/engine_hose.jpg

- Loosen both sides of nuts from the transmission mounts. I mean not just left and right sides but the top & bottom nuts as well. Do not remove them all the way though just loosen them as much as possible to allow the engine/transmission to shift when you lift the engine. I made the mistake of removing the bottom nuts ony and not the top ones. When I got done replacing the engine mounts the transmission became totally misaligned because I took the nuts out completely and allowed the transmission to completely misalign from the mounts.
- Remove the covering that goes over the top of the radiator. I'm talking about that black plastic piece that goes over the radiator and the whole front center part of the engine bay. It's held in with 4 screws and 2 rivots.
- Remove center engine cover (allows room for engine to lift enough without hitting top/back engine area near the firewall).

http://www.alphazone1.com/pics/engine_room1.jpg

- Clip out the center grille section at the base of the windshield. There's 3 clips holding it in. You may need to remove the center rubber moulding first.
- After removing the grille section you can see the two screws that hold in the center housing that contains all the wires running accross the rear of the engine bay (just in front of the firewall). Remove those two screws so that you can manouvre that part around to allow the engine to lift enough.

http://www.alphazone1.com/pics/grille_windshield.jpg

- Place a 2x4 under the oil pan to distribute the load while jacking up the engine. I needed to put the jack 2/3rds the way to the left of the oil pan area to balance the engine a bit so it would lift both left and right sides close to evenly. It still was heavier on the passenger side as the mass of the engine block is offset versus the oil pan area. The piece of 2x4 I cut was about 18" long.

http://www.alphazone1.com/pics/engine_lift1.jpg

- Slowly lift the engine. KEEP A CLOSE EYE on the power steering houses. The intake hose and the one going to the coiling coil are both attached to the chassis so as you lift the engine the power steering fill resevoir is attached to the engine so those hoses get strained. They have no extra lenght. I HAD to remove both hoses from the fluid resevoir or else that would have broke. Thus I had to replace the power steering fluid (about 1.2 quarts).

http://www.alphazone1.com/pics/steering_hoses.jpg

- Also as you lift the engine you will notice the primary cooling fan blade will hit the shroud as you lift the engine since the fan is attached to the engine and the shroud is fixed to the frame. I had to gently manouvre the fan so it would pass in front of the shroud and stick out about 1/2" above it. I could not ge the engine mounts out without raising the engine to the point where the fan blade stuck out a bit over the shroud.
- When there's enough room replace both engine mounts and align the new ones properly.
- Slowly release the jack while checking the seating of the engine mounts. Also keep an idea on the tranmission mounts to make sure they are also seating properly.
- Now you can tighten the nuts for the new engine mounts and transmission mounts. Then put everything else back together.
- Before putting the covering over the radiator make sure everything is aligned properly and that the radiator, shroud and fan are aligned properly. If everything seats back down correctly the fan will have enough room to move between the shroud and the radiator. I always pay particular attention to this area since the shroud and the radiator mounting system is so flimsy it is easy to get misalinged - and you don't want the fan taking off, hitting stuff, and detroying your radiator, housing, hoses, etc..

For me it did not end up being an easy job. It took me about 3 hours. I always take my time and take small breaks and look at things two or three times. I know a lot of people seem to not have to take out nearly as many things as I did but I definitely had to take out all the things I listed above in order to allow clearance to lift the engine.

My old mounts didn't look too bad. Maybe a little hard & worn out. I was wondering if it was necessary. I replaced them as a wear item at 120k, not because I was experiencing any particular vibration or problem. When I went to work this morning I was shocked. It's hard to explain but the car seemed smoother and lighter. Dead serious, it was the same feeling as if you take 200lbs out of the car. Weird. Even the trasmission seemed smoother. This is not placebo effect ;) I know my car extremely well - this was definitely a noticeable change.

L3000C
12-18-2007, 02:28 AM
good writeup.. i am about to order my new mounts.. (im at 140k), and i always thought that this would be easy to do.. but i guess not..

thanks.

tEckniks
12-18-2007, 02:43 AM
did you replace the mounts with stock or poly bushings?

M3C
12-18-2007, 04:55 PM
Nice write up, thanks.

MarkR540
12-18-2007, 05:08 PM
3 hours? this is an hour job max. i dont see how it can take so long. unbolt mounts from top. loosen tranny bracket mounting bolts and then lift engine up with a jack and 2x4. swap new mounts in and drop the engine down.

libravcs
12-18-2007, 08:47 PM
3 hours? this is an hour job max. i dont see how it can take so long. unbolt mounts from top. loosen tranny bracket mounting bolts and then lift engine up with a jack and 2x4. swap new mounts in and drop the engine down.

Im guessing you didnt read his entire writeup about power steering hoses, etc. Correct?And an hour job for one person, may be 6 hours for the next. Whats your point?

JamesM3M5
12-18-2007, 08:59 PM
Most E36's have 16mm nuts for M10 bolts. Very early ones may have 17mm nuts.

FierySphere
12-18-2007, 09:46 PM
Im guessing you didnt read his entire writeup about power steering hoses, etc.

I didn't need to do at that on mine. Just the disconnected the Conforti intake from the HFM, undid the engine mount bolts, lifted the engine and trans, Replaced the mounts.

fiveightandten
12-18-2007, 09:54 PM
Brian, thanks for taking the time to do this writeup. VERY helpful.


-Nick

brianc
12-19-2007, 01:33 AM
yeah I know some people have to remove more stuff than others. There was no way for me to get those mounts out without raising the engine ~2" - and to do that I really had to do everything I mentioned. That's why I did the write-up so don't be surprised if it's a little harder than it seems. I started about 1pm and finished about 4pm. I had to take off and replace a lot of stuff....and it took about 30 minutes just to get the engine and transmission mounts all aligned properly. After getting the new mounts seated I probably raised and lowered the engine 1" or so about 8 times while lining up the engine mounts and the transmission mounts. If I did it again I could do it in 2 hours. That's probably the minimum because of all the stuff I had to remove and then put back. I also had to remove my Dinan strut brace. I replaced the mounts with stock ones.

I added the pictures to the write-up in the original post.

M3C
12-19-2007, 09:22 AM
Is it safe to lift the engine from the oil pan?
I'm asking this because a while back heard that it was not safe and it's better to lift with the engine lift tool from the top.

brianc,
after everything was done and you drove the car, did you feel the difference? can you please shortly describe.

roberttran
12-19-2007, 09:32 AM
subcribed. I plan on doing my mounts before spring autox season :-)

M3BimmerBilly
12-19-2007, 09:45 AM
I supported the engine with 2x4 and jack then unbolted the passenger side mount from the frame and engine mount. Then, took off the bottom nut on the drivers side mount and finally unbolted the passenger side mount on the engine block. I only had to raise the engine a fraction of an inch at most. Put it all back together to spec and then repeated on the drivers side. I had the transmission mounts loosened as well.

I did this one side at a time so the engine was always supported by one mount and the jack as well. Its a 1 hour job if you are in a rush and using handtools. Altho whenever Im under the car, I like to lay there and check everything out form the underside and sometimes take a nap. So I think I burned 2 or 3 hours doing this. Im not working in the pits at the 24 hours of LeMans so I just putz around.

I find this a bit more easier than having to raise the motor 2 inches and both sides at once.

I only noticed a minor difference when I was turning and going over bumps. In that sense it was less notchy shifting as the slector rod was probably better oriented with the driveline. Under straightline acceleration or on the race track - no change whatsoever.

brianc
12-19-2007, 01:44 PM
I find this a bit more easier than having to raise the motor 2 inches and both sides at once

this seems like a fundamental difference between what I did and what you did. I pretty much lifted the engine all at once and replaced both - although I still had to move the jack point around since I couldn't replace both at the same time.
If you're careful and pay close attention this sounds like it might be a good way to attack it. If it works it could definitely be easier and possibly more safe than the way I did it.

M3C
12-19-2007, 02:05 PM
"I supported the engine with 2x4 and jack then unbolted the passenger side mount from the frame and engine mount. Then, took off the bottom nut on the drivers side mount and finally unbolted the passenger side mount on the engine block".


Did you have to remove the mount from engine block?
Any pictures?

This sounds better since you did not have to raise the engine more than 1" and most likely no need to loosen the PS hoses.

M3BimmerBilly
12-19-2007, 03:20 PM
"I supported the engine with 2x4 and jack then unbolted the passenger side mount from the frame and engine mount. Then, took off the bottom nut on the drivers side mount and finally unbolted the passenger side mount on the engine block".


Did you have to remove the mount from engine block?
Any pictures?

This sounds better since you did not have to raise the engine more than 1" and most likely no need to loosen the PS hoses.


Yes, remove the cast aluminum "arm" that attaches to the block with 3 or 4 bolts (cant remember) and the other end rests on top of the motor mount. It comes off very easily.

M3C
12-19-2007, 04:44 PM
Yes, remove the cast aluminum "arm" that attaches to the block with 3 or 4 bolts (cant remember) and the other end rests on top of the motor mount. It comes off very easily.

OK, this was the passenger's side, did you remove this aluminum "arm" the same way on the drivers side (if there is one, not sure)?

xchanger
05-12-2008, 02:54 AM
What about the A/C lines? Did you have problems with them?

timmytimm3
05-12-2008, 08:33 AM
I just did my mounts (OEM MM, and UUC poly TM). I didn't have to disconnect anything. I removed the tranny mount nuts and the exhaust mid-pipe bracket, then jacked one side up at a time. My father watched connections from the top and I looked from the bottom. Just take it slow...

My thread:

http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=992117&highlight=check+your+mounts

Tagz
05-12-2008, 04:07 PM
I replaced my mounts with Vorshlag nylon mounts recently and didn't have to do anything top side. You can get to the top nuts from the bottom side with a 3/8" drive swivel head rachet. Worked very well and no need for two feet of extensions. After unbolting the mounts I backed the bolts out for the cross member so it would drop as far as possible then used a jack to lift one side of the engine at a time. Use a block of wood where the pan meets the block. This will give you the clearance you need without raising the engine so much. I think the whole job took 30 minutes.

xchanger
05-14-2008, 05:38 AM
this seems like a fundamental difference between what I did and what you did. I pretty much lifted the engine all at once and replaced both - although I still had to move the jack point around since I couldn't replace both at the same time.
If you're careful and pay close attention this sounds like it might be a good way to attack it. If it works it could definitely be easier and possibly more safe than the way I did it.

You mentioned that the tranny was out of alignment after loosening the tranny bolts too much. I don't understand what this meant? Did you mean that the tranny mounts were not seated properly, and this caused the tranny to be misaligned, so you had to realign all the mounts to seat properly?

Did you have problems with your A/C lines?