Deep black color glossy shine???

[umermariner]

Hello everyone. I have got my car compounded, and polished twice, but still I never got that Deep Black Color Gloss and Shine in my paint that I see in some BMWs in this forum and real life :(. Why is that so? My car is black...

Thank you.

[The Man]

Are you using a buffer? Cause that will make all the difference.

[umermariner]

well.. yep.. if you mean using polish and then using something (electric maybe) to buff is.. yes.. it was done both times :(

[WolfStrong]

Did you yourself do it or did someone else?

Also remember that much of what you see online is the law of online digital photography. Sure it may look great, especially black, but much of what you are seeing is the reflection of the surroundings that gives the paint it's appearance. If your paint is swirl free, which you can find out by putting it outside on a sunny day at 12:00, then your are already ahead of about 95% of the crowd on this forum on how their car looks. The only question then is simply what kind of wax you are using. If you do see swirls, then that is probably the key to your problem, and if you are polishing the car yourself, tell us your process. If not, I would look for a different detailer.

[umermariner]

I got it detailled from a shop.. and then another different shop.. I doubt that I have swirls.... I think that is the wet look that it lacks.... it might be different kind of wax... what wax would be recommended... also.. maybe some people use quick liquid waxx....
:(
I want it to look even better... the love of my life ;)

[Treepusher]

Read Detailing 101 in the parked threads at the top of the forum. Should answer your questions nicely.

Zaino and the Klasse Twins both give top-notch results, and each has its adherents. But there are plenty of other products out there that work.

[blk328is]

let fminus have a day with it


haha seriously, if two different people have detailed it on two different days and it still doesnt look good you either need to: #1) never take it back to either place, or, #2) your paint is gone.

can you post some pictures so we can see what your working with here?

[WolfStrong]

If you want a wet look, Klasse and Zaino are not the way to go. While they do give a good look, Zaino prides itself not giving a optically clear result which means very little to no wet look.

Now in terms of 'wet look', most of that boils down to not just the wax you use, but also the polish, and most importantly the paint itself. The less orange peal, the more of a wet look you can pull from the paint. Now if the paint is cleaned correctly with no swirls, my advice is to take some paint cleaner and quickly go over the car to remove whatever LSP they used. Meguiar's makes a pretty good one that is mild enough to not swirl the paint and yet strong enough to remove any LSP; pretty cheap too.

This will remove any polish or LSP they layed on, so now your job is to repolish and wax the car, and fortuneatly for you, you can do this all by hand with plenty of ease. For a polish, you are going to want a pure polish with no cleaning ability and that will give you a wet look. Meguiar's again makes a great one in their Deep Crystal line that is easy to use and cheap, but will give an incredibly wet look (Deep Crystal #2 Polish). Mother's also makes a good one that will work just as well (both of which can be bought at virtually any retailer). Now, you are going to wax the car with a wax that will give you a wet look.

Now you have two different types of waxes, synthetics and non-synthetics. Non-synthetics waxes almost always have carnauba in them and are based on that, while others are blended waxes with an assortment of carnauba, bees wax, paraffin wax, and many others. Meguiar's are all blended waxes that are based on polymer technology while Pinnacle and Zymol are going to be waxes based mostly, if only on Carnauba. Some argue either way, but honestly for you I would just go out and buy Meguiar's M26, or Mothers Carnauba wax as both will produce amazingly wet results for a low cost.

Now in terms of synthetic waxes with a wet look, your options are more limited. The #1 synthetic in terms of looks would have to be Meguiar's NXT. It may not last as long as most other synthetics, but no one can argue that it does what it claims with being perhaps the best synthetic in terms of matching the wetness of a carnauba wax, or even surpassing it. If it would interest you, they are reformulating it coming around January with NXT 2.0 which has a hydrophobic effect and should have a much better durability than the previous one if you care to wait.

Now there are many other options out there, with Pinnacle, S100, P28, Zymol, Collnite top ones, that will work as well in terms of the carnauba waxes, but virtually all of these are almost impossible to find other than buying them online, so I just wanted to share the ones that you could stop by today and pick up from a local retailer that will, quit honestly, produce results that will be just as good. The only real difference comes down to personal preference.

[Ianbiz]

If ou want it down quick use Turtle Wax ICE. I personally am not a fan, but I have some that a friend gave to me, and it does work nice and easily on black, but prepare to do it again in about a month or month and a half.

[blk328is]

Now there are many other options out there, with Pinnacle, S100, P28, Zymol, Collnite top ones, that will work as well in terms of the carnauba waxes, but virtually all of these are almost impossible to find other than buying them online


i know the s100 can be had at just about any harley davidson dealership... many towns have them.

[WolfStrong]

i know the s100 can be had at just about any harley davidson dealership... many towns have them.

Yeah your right; I completely forgot about that! P21 can also be had at some dealers as well.

[MJFX328]

Clay the paint. Then clean the paint with a good polish. After youre done some S100 will look sexy.

What buffer do you have?

[VINNIO]

Get A Product Called "hondaglare", It Is Sold At Most High End Motorcycle Dealers .

Honda Racing Approved, It Is Made By Glare.
Follow The Directions And Get Knocked Out!!!!!!!

Super Wet!!! As You Layer The Polish, It Will Get Wetter And Deeper.

But The 3rd And 4th Coat, "wow" Still Looks Wet After 8 Months No B.s.

Great Stuff No Dbout, I Use The P/c 7424, Also Great.

Machine Makes The Paint Deep Like A Pool .

Better Than Zaino. Better Than Mothers Or, Anything On The Shelf At The Local Auto Supply Is Junk.

[MJFX328]

Honda Glare wat the hell

[jbum]

maybe the paint is not in the greatest shape. if the clear coat is not in good shape, it'll be hard to get it to shine.

[blk328is]

Anything On The Shelf At The Local Auto Supply Is Junk.


i stand firmly in the thought that the technique used has more to do with the results than which product you use. so what im saying is i think that someone that uses the correct technique and off the shelf products can yield results just as good , or better than the guy who has little experience and has a sloppy technique and uses very high end stuff.


and WTF is hondaglare?

[WolfStrong]

i stand firmly in the thought that the technique used has more to do with the results than which product you use. so what im saying is i think that someone that uses the correct technique and off the shelf products can yield results just as good , or better than the guy who has little experience and has a sloppy technique and uses very high end stuff.


and WTF is hondaglare?

Completely agree. There is absolutely nothing wrong with 'off the shelf' products. Technique is without a doubt the most important thing when tied with patience, edurance, the eye to catch the small details, and prep work! FYI for all the nay-sayers about Meguiar's or Mother's products; both are used in Pebble Beach compitions and completely obliterate many other of your 'high end' stuff. In fact, if I am not mistaken, it is Meguiar's, not Zymol or Pinnacle, that holds the record for most Concours victories with products you could buy at PepBoys, Autozone, Kragen, or Napa.

Am I saying that Meguiar's and Mother's are the best, no. What I am saying though is that while the high end stuff may seem attractive for one reason or another, it really won't offer much more, if anymore benefits than the $15 tin off the shelf. Some people like the $1500 crystal display of Zymol because it has the unique ability to release dirt and debree with just water and a very mild soap which means a true touchless wash. Is that worth $1485? Well that depends on who you are asking. Perhaps you want to talk about the absolute brilliant easy of application and removal of P21S Concours Carnauba for $30 compared to $15 which may not be so easy. Or perhaps some buy the $15 tin of S100/Mothers/Meguiar's because while it may not be the easiest thing to use, it is still easy; while it may not release and protect as well as some, it still does a fantastic job. What we do know is that it is cheap, gets the job done, and given the right prep work, gives us a breathtaking shine.

It all boils down to finding a product that YOU enjoy working with.

[JohnZ3MC]

Your car is a 99 but a couple of professionals have compounded it and polished it and applied something.
Why not go to autogeek.net, a sponsor, and get the most famous carnauba in the history of the world for black (and red) cars - Pinnacle Souveran. It's currently on sale so you get two tubs for the price of one.
Put on 1 coat following the directions. Wait a few days and wash lightly. Apply a 2nd coat of Souveran. Repeat the wait a few days and wash lightly and apply another coat of Souveran until you have lots of coats of Souveran. (By waiting a few days, the wax will harden and set up properly and not be removed by a really quick next coat.)
You'll have a really deep and wet shine and you can sell the 2nd tub of Souveran to a pal (or your mom) and recoup your cash.
That would be my game plan.
Good luck,
-John C.

[WolfStrong]

Your car is a 99 but a couple of professionals have compounded it and polished it and applied something.
Why not go to autogeek.net, a sponsor, and get the most famous carnauba in the history of the world for black (and red) cars - Pinnacle Souveran. It's currently on sale so you get two tubs for the price of one.
Put on 1 coat following the directions. Wait a few days and wash lightly. Apply a 2nd coat of Souveran. Repeat the wait a few days and wash lightly and apply another coat of Souveran until you have lots of coats of Souveran. (By waiting a few days, the wax will harden and set up properly and not be removed by a really quick next coat.)
You'll have a really deep and wet shine and you can sell the 2nd tub of Souveran to a pal (or your mom) and recoup your cash.
That would be my game plan.
Good luck,
-John C.
Pinnacle is on sale, and for the price that it is right now, it is a fantastic buy!

[740ibimmer]

Fminus should chime in; i think i and others would agree that technique is key

[umermariner]

Thanks guys. Two questions,
1) What makes Pinnacle Souveran better than the others. I went to autogeek.com, and they recommend to use it after every wash... I would rather wana spend 2-3 hours every 8-9 months than doing it after every wash. Does it really not last more than a wast?
2) It is available in different types (spray, paste etc). Which one is recommended. And I did not find any sale on any of them :(.
Thanks again :).

[VINNIO]

Hondaglare Is The Same As Glare Pro Polish With Glassplexin!!???

Guess You People Have Never Heared Of It ???

If You Try It , Just Like Driving A Bmw , You Will Know.

Not Cheap But A Little Goes A Long Way, Super Wet And Lasts And Lasts.

Honda Is The Company That Supports This Product And Has Put There Name On It.

Aircraft,motorcycle,marine,auto,approved.

[umermariner]

Hondaglare Is The Same As Glare Pro Polish With Glassplexin!!???

Guess You People Have Never Heared Of It ???

If You Try It , Just Like Driving A Bmw , You Will Know.

Not Cheap But A Little Goes A Long Way, Super Wet And Lasts And Lasts.

Honda Is The Company That Supports This Product And Has Put There Name On It.

Aircraft,motorcycle,marine,auto,approved.
Any Idea how much it is? And which is the best place to get it?
Thanks.

[VINNIO]

If You Have Not Heared Of Somthing Does Not Mean It Is No Good!

I Am In The Biz For 25 Yrs, We Use 3m,s21,glare Pro Products,
On A Black,red,dark Blue, It Is The Glare Products We Use.

It Is Easy To Pick-up At A Motorcycle Dealer As Hondaglare, Or Buy Direct On Line.

Holds Up Very Well In The North East After Your 1st Clay,compound,micro Finish,spider,pro Polish,.

All You Will Do With The Paint Is Top Off Spring And Fall With The Polish Only.

[kosta]

+1

[VINNIO]

A U T O P O L I S H . Net

Home Base Is In Vegas.

All The Info Is On The Site.

Good Luck And If You Do Try In Do Not Use Alot Of Any Of The Products Or You Will Have A Hard Time With Removal.

Thin,thin, Thin!!!!

Do All The Steps Depending On Condition Of Your Paintwork, If You Would Let Me Know I May Be Able To Assist You.

Use Must Use A P/c 7424 With L/c Pads.
Do You Know What This Means??

Advise.

[WolfStrong]

I'm far from sold on that product.

Don't take this personal, but you only have 6 posts, You Type Every Word Starting With a Caps, and I just find it hard to take anyone seriously like that. On their site they even recommend using a cordless orbital buffer, and no matter what type of product you are using, there is absolutely no way you will be able to do proper work on paint with that. It also seems as if your a salesmen for them after looking at all but 1 of your posts mention Glare products. Plus, their site just kinda bothers me with that 'sound' that pops up every click.

Again, I am not trying to point you out in paticular, but know that this sort of thing happens all the time with products no one has really heard of all over detailing forums. What I would like to see is a side by side comparison of this product vs something someone has actually heard of.

[VINNIO]

The great and powerful wolf strong, the boy with a thousand post's.

I would love for you to come to my shop, put you in the front loader for a couple of turns.

I guess you know all about everything to due with cars I have had people like you tell me this and that for my first couple of weeks in the business before you were born.

I would check what you think you know about something before making parking lot judgments about people you do not know.

Go to Honda motor corp. and do a side by side with whatever wax or turtle wax product, and do a side by side.

They could put there name on any product.

I would love for you to put your judgment and insults to the test and contact Honda Motor Corp.and ask them to go head to head with whatever autogeek is blowing out this month for x-mass.

[WolfStrong]

The great and powerful wolf strong, the boy with a thousand post's.

I would love for you to come to my shop, put you in the front loader for a couple of turns.

I guess you know all about everything to due with cars I have had people like you tell me this and that for my first couple of weeks in the business before you were born.

I would check what you think you know about something before making parking lot judgments about people you do not know.

Go to Honda motor corp. and do a side by side with whatever wax or turtle wax product, and do a side by side.

They could put there name on any product.

I would love for you to put your judgment and insults to the test and contact Honda Motor Corp.and ask them to go head to head with whatever autogeek is blowing out this month for x-mass.

Listen, like I said, I have nothing against you, Honda, or that company. I never claimed to be an all knowing person or anything of the sort. What I am saying is that if you go on Autopia, Autogeek, ect and have 6 posts, all of which rave about a company that not many, if anyone, has heard of, you will get suspended, pending investigation for connections with that company.

I believe it is just a simple misunderstanding between us; I have nothing against you, nor do I doubt your ability or experience. You have to understand where many people come from though, especially on an online forum, that there are people out there simply making accounts to gain support for a product. I work at a branded dealership myself and trust me, they put their name behind a product that I have infact tested and believe that it is just another snake oil. I have seen people with 'years' of experience buff a car and almost want to run, grab the buffer from them, and start all over myself. So, even if it is branded by Honda, I'm sure you can understand why myself, and many others, would be skeptical about hearing from it from a new member when we never heard of the company.

It is the sad, yet awful truth in this industry, and I'm sure you have had experience with that. I apologize if my post came off the wrong way or confussing.

Still, the fact remains simple. Prep work is where the war is won, not what type of products you use. This, above everything, is why I remain unmoved when hyped products come out, because I know, given that I prep the surface accordingly, I can make that $15 tin outshine the $1000 cystal jar.

[VINNIO]

I agree with you, prep is the key. And as always will be in mostly anything you do in your life.

$ 10 steak is great, till you have a $75 steak .

We use s21,3m??? for years, am I able to mention these companies.

I have stated before, we have customers who prefer this product, maybe because you are on the west coast you have not heard much about this product because in the bodyshop end of finishing it has been around for over 10yrs.

have you ever gone to bike week in Fl.??? it is the polish of choice, so depending on your location you may have not hear much about it. case closed on this end, it was just a person sharing information with another .

freedom of speach is not a good thing on this site ???

sounds strange, the way you type about being new here and I could get blocked????!!!

Do you work for autogeek????

Nothing personal, but you seam like you are doing security for them .

I buy from auto geek and spend at least $200.00 per month with this vendor, The sales rep. visits me here in N.Y. we also use Gliptone products heard of them???? made right hear in good old N.Y.
there products also are outstanding, you should give them the old side by side, wolf you will like it!!!!
live alittle.

[Totoland]

........Still, the fact remains simple. Prep work is where the war is won, not what type of products you use. This, above everything, is why I remain unmoved when hyped products come out, because I know, given that I prep the surface accordingly, I can make that $15 tin outshine the $1000 cystal jar.

200% Correct in that statement. I have boxes full of products that I've tried looking for the next "miracle"... And, after 2 years and a couple of hundred BMW reconditioning jobs, learned my lessons in surface prep.

As far as taking it to a detailer, ask them what their process is. Do they spend several hours in compounding and polishing? That's where your base shine is going to originate. For example, I average 6-8 hours in just that process alone.

To go from this finish:

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o212/Totoland/Black%20530i%20Scratchy%20Sep07/530i_Scratchy_TrunkSwirls.jpg

To this finish:

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o212/Totoland/Black%20530i%20Scratchy%20Sep07/530I_HoodreflectOutside.jpg

Takes a lot of time, patience, minimal product use, maximum polisher use and knowledge of the paint.

Toto

[VINNIO]

Yes I do agree, all about the prep.

8 hrs is that man hours??? or one person working on one car for 8hrs b/f final polish??
How much do you get for a detail ???

how much time is spent doing the inside ???man hour wise. I know it depends on the condition.

lets just say this car you have in the picture above.

[VINNIO]

it would have been nice to see the after pic. of the same spot from the same angle,in the sun.

[Totoland]

Yes I do agree, all about the prep.

8 hrs is that man hours??? or one person working on one car for 8hrs b/f final polish??
How much do you get for a detail ???

how much time is spent doing the inside ???man hour wise. I know it depends on the condition.

lets just say this car you have in the picture above.

Vinnio: yes, that is man hours. Sometimes the dealer will jump in and assist. The hours are usually broken down by compounding to remove scratches and swirls (estimate 40% of the time) and 60% in polishing to bring the paint to: as close to perfect as possible.

Interior detailing usually takes 3 hours (including trunk because the Bimmers are for resale when I complete them) and 45 minutes to clean motor. I probably average 12-14 hours per car (including power washing, wheel clean, etc)

As far as payment goes, let's say it's adequate...I'm not getting wealthy by any means, but I can support my family.

I looked at my photo album for this car and didn't get the exact spot in the sun for a before/after of the trunk lip, but here's another sun shot. It's metallic black so you'll see that in the sun.

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o212/Totoland/Black%20530i%20Scratchy%20Sep07/530i_OutsideViewLowerShot.jpg

Toto

[VINNIO]

Toto,

thank you.

the cars look great!!! nice job.

do you use s21 products ??

[WolfStrong]

Awesome Job Toto :)

I have no relation to any detailing product company just for everyones reference. What I said was merly to give some helpful advice just for not just yours, but everyone elses sake who might be viewing on just some friendly courtesies of online posting.

[Totoland]

Vinnio: Thanks for the compliment. Much appreciated! As far as using s21 products: no, I've never tried them, but hear they are very good. In today's highly competitive auto market, there are literally hundreds of good products available. I tend to pick one or two and use them constantly. But, I always try to see what is out there and what advantages they have.

Wolfstrong: I understand completely. Sometimes, this here "net" can flare up on ya.....but it usually settles right down LOL.

Take care folks. I've got a stunning 645 Titanium Silver the dealer just purchased to detail....awesome lines on that ride and it only has 29/k.

Toto

[VINNIO]

Wolf strong,

That was exactly what I was trying to do before being attacked .

I wish you a happy and healthy holliday season and new year.


Peace

[WolfStrong]

Wolfstrong: I understand completely. Sometimes, this here "net" can flare up on ya.....but it usually settles right down LOL.

Toto

Tell me about it; been using online forums for years and know exactly what you mean.

On a side note, you know your obsessed when you dry off your car after parking it from the rain....:redspot :help