Windshield cracking design flaw?

[parabellum]

My friends have a Cooper S...I believe its an 04 (I have to double check that one).

They, in 2 years...have been through FOUR WINDSHIELDS!!!!

They install a new one...it cracks. They replace it under warrantee...it cracks...rinse, repeat.

At $1300 a pop...this is a flaw I couldn't live with. The dealer tells them it is a design flaw and to extend their warrantee.

Personally, MINI would already have given me back my money if it were my car...but its not.

Does anyone know about this issue? Is there any known solution?

Just trying to help my friends...they love their car...but they can't afford a $1300 windshield twice a year....:eek:

Thanks.

[xhealey]

Havn't noticed a crack yet .... but I hear this popping sound...only once each time I take it on the road...sounds like a stone hitting the windshield...but no cars around....don't hear it again until I take the car out. Could it be the windshield or a motor mount...comes from under the dash below the windshield.

[2002mpower]

that happened to my dads when he had one. it went completly across the windshield . but then again he beat the life out of it on the track aha

[G. P. Burdell]

There's been a lot of discussion of the windshield cracking problem over at the North American Motoring (http://www.northamericanmotoring.com/) forums.

[parabellum]

Theirs also does the popping sound...keep an eye on your windshield.

In most modern cars, the windsheild provides something like 60-70% of the structural integrity of the roof...I guess Mini gave theirs a little too much?

Thanks for the link, I'll check that out.

[Koopah]

Yes, windshields have been an issue. More cases between 2001 and 2004 model years, fewer since.

BTW - $1300 is a bit steep :eek: . I've had two (rain-sensing wiper) windshields replaced by my MINI dealer and each one was between $450-500, parts and labor.

Who is doing the work for them? :confused

Theo

[parabellum]

BMW/MINI of Indianapolis...if there is more than one, I'm not sure exactly which one.

Yeah, $1300 is freaking highway robbery.

I did some looking and told them to go with the PPG windshield for $250 that is being reported as much more durable (and was measured to be slightly thicker also).

Man...if that was my car I would be PISSED OFF...especially if you take it in and some asshat service advisor gives your car the 'pen test'.

[Tmini]

Had rock crack mine (04) once but other than that I have not had any issues and I track the car hard. Many dealers will replace it with an aftermarket windshield that is weaker (cheaper) so that could be the issue. Check to see if they are using OEM glass. Have not heard of the PPG but if it is truly stronger that might be the way to go also. Also, my insurance has zero deductable on glass so I would suggest having your friends check to see if they can get this on their policy...and then make sure that they will allow them to use OEM glass if it has to be replaced. I had to specifically request this and get my insurance company to approve it but they did.

[Koopah]

Please note that as of about 8 months ago, PPG did not make a replacement windshield for MINIs with rain-sensing wipers.

And, actually, I have heard good things about the quality of the PPG vs. OEM. However, MINI may have improved quality, especially in the last year or so.

Theo

[parabellum]

After much reading on mini-specific forums...I found that this was a HUGE problem up until the late 04 early 05 models...so I guess Mini (though they completely deny the problem, jerks) has figured it out and made a fix.

From what I understand the PPG glass is just a hair thicker, which may actually make the difference between taking all that stress and not taking it.

An auto glass expert that I talked to recently (as he put a new windshield on guess what...a mini cooper) told me that in most modern designs, the glass can contribute up to 70% of the total structural rigidity of the roof...so this problem with the Mini isn't too big a surprise I guess.

[MINIGURU]

My 06 MINI S got a stress crack back in August but got it warranted without too much hassle.

[parabellum]

Did they jerk you around with the Pen Test? What BS that is....

[MINIGURU]

Oh yeah, but the glass place said that no matter what all cracks will crack and go through chips. So that would make the pen test worthless.

[ih8fizzix]

Had rock crack mine (04) once but other than that I have not had any issues and I track the car hard. Many dealers will replace it with an aftermarket windshield that is weaker (cheaper) so that could be the issue. Check to see if they are using OEM glass. Have not heard of the PPG but if it is truly stronger that might be the way to go also. Also, my insurance has zero deductable on glass so I would suggest having your friends check to see if they can get this on their policy...and then make sure that they will allow them to use OEM glass if it has to be replaced. I had to specifically request this and get my insurance company to approve it but they did.

Just out of curiousity, whose your insurance provider. I have a rock chip on my windshield, and even with full coverage from Allstate my windshield isnt covered.

[bmwguy00]

ive heard of this

on some mini forum a guy posted that he hit a pot hole in the rain and the back glass just cracked

but this was like 2 years ago, there were several people that had the same issues with the rear glass

[e28forlife]

What is the pen test? How does it work?

[parabellum]

The pen test is what Mini corporate has their service advisers do, to cheat Mini customers out of a warranty claim. Seriously.

It works like this: The service adviser takes a ball point pen and draws it over the crack...if it hesitates or sticks...then Mini says it must have been due to a rock and not a design flaw.

This is ridiculous for many reasons:

1) When glass cracks, even safety glass, it fissures and splinters at the source of the crack...so even normal cracks from their design flaw will fail the pen test.

2) If glass has an abnormal amount of stress contained within it...you can't see it. A rock can hit a weak spot and shatter a piece of glass under stress, where the same rock would never have broken another identical piece of glass without the same stress.

So the bottom line is that Mini is leaving it 100% up to the dealerships to make the determination....meanwhile, they deny this is a problem...but have redesigned the glass in their 05 models...05 models and later do not seem to have this problem.

[LarryL]

Keep in mind that the nearly vertical angle of the Mini windshield makes it MUCH more susceptible to breakage. A tiny rock with a sharp point can easily crack a windshield. When it's a highly stressed piece like the Mini glass, it's easy for the crack to spread immediately.

The pen test isn't BS. It's a good way to show customers that there is indeed an impact point - if there is one. A visual inspection will usually reveal a pit somewhere in the middle or at the end of a crack. The pen test proves it.

PS - 99% of the time, the stealership doesn't install glass. They sub it out to glass companies and then mark it up 200%.

[parabellum]

The pen test isn't BS. It's a good way to show customers that there is indeed an impact point - if there is one. A visual inspection will usually reveal a pit somewhere in the middle or at the end of a crack. The pen test proves it.

I am not trying to pick a fight with you. But this post is clearly misinformed. Not only is the complete lack of scientific method in the pen test, *painfully* obvious, having it administered by a service advisor is also ridiculous. Also, you are clearly someone who has not seen their windshield crack while the car was sitting STILL, only to have that same windshield fail the 'pen test' and be told that it was a rock that cracked the windshield.

Mini has received *thousands* of complaints about this problem, it is a wide spread issue for pre 05 models. The pen test is clearly a maneuver to pass the costs of fixing this problem to the customer, instead of owning up to an obvious design flaw and standing by their product.

I also contacted three local auto glass places about this method of testing glass...all of them have been in this business at least 20 years. All of them said such a test was complete dealership BS, for the very reasons I listed.

There is no need to continue this thread, unless someone wants to. I found enough info to help my friends and find them a solution that will work for their car post warranty.

To other mini owners: Its up to you...if you are subject to the pen test, judge its merits for yourself.