anyone raced an sti yet?

[m3chaser]

this kid wants to race me with his STI. he cannot drive from what my buddies are telling me, but from what i hear they are not hard to launch. now i noo that his car is faster then mine, but if he can't drive well then perhaps i might have a chance from 10-100. tell me what you fella's think and look at my mods before you do.

also, what is the best situation for me against this kid( besides not racing him...ahahaha)? should i go from a 0,10,20 mph? let me know would ya fella's.

p.s. this kid apparently never races his car and never brings it over 4k rpm's, so i am guessing that he is rather inexperienced.

[NakNak]

That 3.38 should help you quite a bit but I still think he will edge you out too 100. Your best bet is a race to 150.

[m3chaser]

thanks bro, and man is your car hooooot!!!!!!!! would it be better if i raced him just to 80 mph?

[Travis10]

no, with their awd, and turbo, they are very fast on the lower end of the spectrum, he said you should race to 150, because at the top end, they tend to "die out", and you will start pulling on him.

[m3chaser]

soo should i start him from like say 70mph or higher? oh yea, my car is done at 140mph cause of my gearing. i don't have a chip yet soo redline is 6500.

[NLR]

Is it even possible to hit 150 with a 3.38lsd in an M3?

[bennyfizzle]

if you dont hav a chip you cant even pull to 130 ...

[m3chaser]

holy poop NLR!!!! you ran a 13.7 with just an intake? i have yet to go to the track, but you must be an excellent drag racer. teach me....as a matter of fact i should be down in the orlando area next year sometime in the spring. perhaps i could meet up with you one day while i am down there.

[m3chaser]

i beg to differ benny fizzle. i raced a new G35 cpe 6mt 298hp from 70-140mph. 140mph was all i could do, but i got it there. i started 2 cls back from him and ended 2cls ahead of him.

[nismo skyline]

race from 60 to 150. i raced my friends modded evo from 50 to about 120 and i put a few bus lenghts on him

[m3chaser]

bennyy fizzle i see you have a 95 325is.... great car!! i had one before i bought my M3, but it was totalled by a 19yr old guy who sideswiped me goin about 100mph!! i had a jc chip, cosmos intake, and custom exhaust and i had my 95 325is at 145mph against a 3.0 Z4.....he raped me, but it was fun. i would shift outta 3rd goin 98mph approx. and outta 4th goin 130mph. the gearing was abit taller then the M3, but i like the shorter gearing much much more. once again excellent car!!!

[m3chaser]

nismo, what do you have done to your M3? love the rims by the way

[OneImprezziveRS]

if he's inexperienced, then you may have an edge. If he has his driver controlled center diff dialed to the rear, he may still have an advantage. and if you're in VA right now (with the rain), he will even have a better chance of holding up. See if it was me driving the STI, I would brake boost and hold my boost at 15psi while you give the go :)

[EnzoXYZ]

Top gear my friend TOP GEAR. Go from 30-100 in top gear. YOU WILL KILL HIM.


this kid wants to race me with his STI. he cannot drive from what my buddies are telling me, but from what i hear they are not hard to launch. now i noo that his car is faster then mine, but if he can't drive well then perhaps i might have a chance from 10-100. tell me what you fella's think and look at my mods before you do.

also, what is the best situation for me against this kid( besides not racing him...ahahaha)? should i go from a 0,10,20 mph? let me know would ya fella's.

p.s. this kid apparently never races his car and never brings it over 4k rpm's, so i am guessing that he is rather inexperienced.

[f ll th bl nks]

Your S50 has the better of the manifolds.
Start the race from 75 in 3rd.

[manuelku]

lol, you mean racing him 30-150 in 5th? those sti and evo has no speed when at 5th... i think i have seen top gear talking about those car in one of the video

[m3chaser]

enzo, your M3 has got to be one of the sexiest cars i have ever had the pleasure of laying my eyes on. i wanna be friends with it.

[nismo skyline]

nismo, what do you have done to your M3? love the rims by the way

at the time i raced him i just had intake and exhaust. i thought he was in the wrong gear, but he was in the right gear. it didnt seem like it, right after we both punched it i immediatly pulled 2 cars on him.

[mazur]

at the time i raced him i just had intake and exhaust. i thought he was in the wrong gear, but he was in the right gear. it didnt seem like it, right after we both punched it i immediatly pulled 2 cars on him.

What mods, like exhaust, boost controller?

Anyways, I raced an STi with exhaust from a dig and beat him by several feet even though he had the better launch (we only raced to 80...traffic ahead of me) and I had an extra 110#'s in the passenger seat.

I was surprised. I think there's too much hype behind those cars, as if they are unbeatable or something. I have also recently learned a car with boost "feels" a lot faster than it actually is.

[OneImprezziveRS]

What mods, like exhaust, boost controller?

Anyways, I raced an STi with exhaust from a dig and beat him by several feet even though he had the better launch (we only raced to 80...traffic ahead of me) and I had an extra 110#'s in the passenger seat.

I was surprised. I think there's too much hype behind those cars, as if they are unbeatable or something. I have also recently learned a car with boost "feels" a lot faster than it actually is.

The STI's are cows dude. They are fast cars though. It's just that most drivers don't know the gearing on them well enough to to utilize the powerband. For a new car for $34k, in my opinion, it is one of the safest and fastest cars out there in that price range.

[apollo322]

They are heavy with all that extra weight, and they do seem to have emphysema over 100 mph. Race him at high speeds.:buttrock

[m3chaser]

hey mazur, my comp is acting funny and it won't show me your sig. what do you have done to your car?

[LboogieG12]

i haven't raced an STi, but i've seen them pull pretty quick. & that was going up a hill. i say that you could probably take him.

but since he's an inexperienced driver, don't waste your time on him. just my $.02.

[nismo skyline]

What mods, like exhaust, boost controller?



turbo back exhaust, bov, and bigger fmic

[ChevelleRyan]

unless this kid sucks cock at driving big time and misses every shift...you will loose

[OneImprezziveRS]

Why don't you just race him and get it over with lol. I mean, you are close to 75lbs lighter between weight in both cars excluding drivers. Every STI will be different as every driver skill will be. Just be safe and I would take it to the track if it was me because if this kid is inexperienced, then you two may endanger each other and possibly others.

If he has TBE amd bigger FMIC, the car is a different animal with a free flowing exhaust. Just do a couple of runs: rolling start, complete stop.

[Binzes]

I have raced a couple STi's Before, And usually from a roll its neck and neck, but from a stop hey pulls me by about a car Then I slowly lower his lead to about a half car.

EDIT:
Heres (http://videos.streetfire.net/Player.aspx?fileid=27671402-5202-4B60-81EC-403D0DF21601&kw=30&p=3)a vid of my car vs a stock STi (last two races). FYI, the guy that edited the video put in my worse launch from a dig, we actually raced from a launch four times, but that time I didn't focus properly and missed my launch.

[332 RustBucket]

I have a VERY hard time with equal drivers believing that the Sti won't KILL a stock m3 or slightly modded one. They have 300hp@6000 rpm, 300ft torque@4000rpm. STOCK. I am VERY modded and at the track can BARELY pull on a Sti. Now maybe it isn't the best comparo as he might be getting a better run off the corner putting me behind from the beg. but still. 240 hp and 230 something tq is NO chance for 300 hp and 300 tq :D NOT GOING TO HAPPEN.

For an example I was at Limerock park a couple of weeks ago behind a Sti (we were both behind a car coming down the down hill onto the front straight) we both hit the gas and he started pulling on me like I do to a slightly modded e36 m3 (intake, exhaust, pullies, euro hfm. no rear gears) I went up to the guy as he was turning 1 min flat at Limerock (which for those of you who don't know is VERY quick for a basically stock car) and he said it was a stage 1 car of his buddies shop. I asked what the car had and he said, chip, exhaust, and one other small thing. Got to love those turbo cars... He said he as at around 340 hp and 390 ft lbs tq at the crank:eyecrazy :eyecrazy

I could catch him in the braking zone but had zero chance in the corners. :(

Anyhow, I don't see how you would have a chance against this guy based on my experiance. Heck, the Sti is in e46 m3 territory:) Now we all know that it takes a TON to keep up with a e46 m3:)

[mazur]

I have a VERY hard time with equal drivers believing that the Sti won't KILL a stock m3 or slightly modded one. They have 300hp@6000 rpm, 300ft torque@4000rpm. STOCK. I am VERY modded and at the track can BARELY pull on a Sti. Now maybe it isn't the best comparo as he might be getting a better run off the corner putting me behind from the beg. but still. 240 hp and 230 something tq is NO chance for 300 hp and 300 tq :D NOT GOING TO HAPPEN.


You're comparing our drivetrain loss of 15% to theirs of 23%. Then add some wieght. Not very much ahead of us that are slightly modded.

Also, I'm not sure where he got them torque numbers from. An STi with 342hp has about 333tq and one with 390tq has about 382hp. I'm sourcing this from - http://dyno-comp.com/subaru.php?view=subaru

[Mr.Cosmos]

I raced one a while back the guy had mods too, we raced from a roll. He pulled on me of course, but I thought it would be more for some reason. We raced like from stop light to the next light so he prob would just keep pulling if we raced longer. The guy was cool to gave me thumbs up and went are ways. He had Cf front too.

[332 RustBucket]

You're comparing our drivetrain loss of 15% to theirs of 23%. Then add some wieght. Not very much ahead of us that are slightly modded.

Also, I'm not sure where he got them torque numbers from. An STi with 342hp has about 333tq and one with 390tq has about 382hp. I'm sourcing this from - http://dyno-comp.com/subaru.php?view=subaru


I honestly don't have a clue where he got the tq number from but I can tell you the friggin car MOVED. I honestly would believe him over you posting up the graph not from his company. I might not have quoted the correct mods as I really didn't care I was just amazed HOW QUICK he was:eyecrazy He knew what cars both a board member here and I were driving and that he wasn't selling us anything so I can't really see him lying. :dunno


Specs - 1996 and later

M3 -
240 hp
236 tq
3175lb


Sti - 2004

300 hp
300 tq
3,263 lbs

So we have 80 lbs diff. Not going to do much of anything. Once you are in motion the savings have LITTLE effect. Most Mags. rate the 0-60 in sub 5 sec. times, the 1/4 in low 13's (both of which will destroy a e36 m3 (mostly stock)

You say 23% drivetrain is going to do that much. I don't think so.

Here is a graph of a stock Sti.

http://www.stifiles.com/chapter7/stockSTI.jpg

Now I don't know much about sti's but it would take quite a bit for a e36 m3 to beat those type of numbers. I have seen graphs with higher numbers too just decided to post these. Anyhow, 95% of the time I can't see a e36 beating a sti with equal drivers. I think that you guys smoke a little too much sometimes :D:D ;)

[OneImprezziveRS]

I have a VERY hard time with equal drivers believing that the Sti won't KILL a stock m3 or slightly modded one. They have 300hp@6000 rpm, 300ft torque@4000rpm. STOCK. I am VERY modded and at the track can BARELY pull on a Sti. Now maybe it isn't the best comparo as he might be getting a better run off the corner putting me behind from the beg. but still. 240 hp and 230 something tq is NO chance for 300 hp and 300 tq :D NOT GOING TO HAPPEN.

For an example I was at Limerock park a couple of weeks ago behind a Sti (we were both behind a car coming down the down hill onto the front straight) we both hit the gas and he started pulling on me like I do to a slightly modded e36 m3 (intake, exhaust, pullies, euro hfm. no rear gears) I went up to the guy as he was turning 1 min flat at Limerock (which for those of you who don't know is VERY quick for a basically stock car) and he said it was a stage 1 car of his buddies shop. I asked what the car had and he said, chip, exhaust, and one other small thing. Got to love those turbo cars... He said he as at around 340 hp and 390 ft lbs tq at the crank:eyecrazy :eyecrazy

I could catch him in the braking zone but had zero chance in the corners. :(

Anyhow, I don't see how you would have a chance against this guy based on my experiance. Heck, the Sti is in e46 m3 territory:) Now we all know that it takes a TON to keep up with a e46 m3:)


At last a "non-biased" reply. I personally own an STI equipped Impreza. I have actually raced several e36 and e46 m3's. All of them except one(e46 m3 spraying) I have whooped by at least 2 cars until about 130 when the m starts creeping up.I have loved M3's since I first laid eyes on a 1990 Alpine White when I was 13 years old so no bias here just being more realistic. I have driven several STI's in different stages of mods. All I can say is this:

A more practical match in a straight line stock for stock is e46 m3 vs. sti. If you're shooting for top speed runs, the STI will give you a run for your money but the m3 will have an advantage.

And the weight difference between an e36 m3 and sti is 75lbs., not enough to have weight in the equation in my opinion.

Again, quit being a wuss :stickoutt and just race him if you really want to find out the outcome. :buttrock

[332 RustBucket]

mazur - IMO you are slightly modded for a NA m3 if those mods are correct in your sig.

[PALELLA]

Street racing is gay!! Take it to the track!!!!!

[332 RustBucket]

Street racing is gay!! Take it to the track!!!!!


Well put newb.:rolleyes

[aeryk7]

Believe me when i tell you, do a 2nd gear roll at 5000k. rpms (50mph w/a 3.15 diff) , stomp it and i can almost guarantee you to stay atleast door to door through 3rd gear.
Believe me it is your best chance. Its not good to stay at revs this high for a long period of time but i have dont roll ons from 5.5k rpms many and many of times to totally surprise high HP cars , surprised some bikes too . Surprised them enough for a 1000RR to tell me that my car was fast. (He beat me bad but he and other bikes have given me props)

[kdcass25]

The subies die on the highway. I had a 02 wrx. 237hp stock, right with the e36 M3.

I out ran a WRX on the highway from 60-100ish. In my 318ti :eek: only 140hp. I was suprised myself. It was close, he got a slight jump, but the 318ti just slowly and steadily pulled. He shut down when by back bumper was at his front. :buttrock (I am aware the this exploited both the advantage's for the 318ti and disadvatages of the WRX)

Back to topic STI 300hp vs 240hp M3, based on my experience with the subaru's you win from a roll at any speed. Especially at hwy speeds.

From a stand still the subie will win. IF hes welling to rev to 5k and let loose.

0-60 and quater mile is all about the launch.

Nothing launchs like an AWD car.

my .02

-Dave Cass

[mose121]

FYI: if you're racing from a stop, prepare to get stomped on. When you dump the clutch at 4500 in the STI, it feels like you getting catapulted off an aircraft carrier. Especially if he has the basic chip/exhaust mods which are good for upwards of 50whp in the STI.

[kdcass25]

FYI: if you're racing from a stop, prepare to get stomped on. When you dump the clutch at 4500 in the STI, it feels like you getting catapulted off an aircraft carrier. Especially if he has the basic chip/exhaust mods which are good for upwards of 50whp in the STI.

BUMP they will HURT you. Did that once back was sore for a week LOL :buttrock

[skratch]

if you dont hav a chip you cant even pull to 130 ...

thats not true Iv done 160 on my speedo at 7200 im sure 6800 stock redline will get you to 150+

race him at 80 in 3rd or he will pull on you they loose steam because he will be in 4th at 80

[hbombfilmsstar9]

i say go for it. i raced a 12.3 second evo froma a 1st gear roll and he only pulled by 3-4 car lengths on me

[mose121]

The subies die on the highway. I had a 02 wrx. 237hp stock, right with the e36 M3.



Not a big deal, but the WRX's are 227hp, not 237.

[motorsports321]

well a friend of mine kept up with a sti weaving through traffic, and he had on dinan stage 2 basically, and stripped out the back of his car, and had in racing seats. the sti was stock though but he couldnt shake us off :D, but he did sure grip the road, it was insane.

[332 RustBucket]

thats not true Iv done 160 on my speedo at 7200 im sure 6800 stock redline will get you to 150+

race him at 80 in 3rd or he will pull on you they loose steam because he will be in 4th at 80


I think what he is saying is that the stock car is LIMITED in speed to 130. Without a chip you have ZERO chance in an m3 to hit 150:)

[332 RustBucket]

well a friend of mine kept up with a sti weaving through traffic, and he had on dinan stage 2 basically, and stripped out the back of his car, and had in racing seats. the sti was stock though but he couldnt shake us off :D, but he did sure grip the road, it was insane.


Wow, he kept up weaving in and out of traffic. :rolleyes What does that mean? NOTHING other than your friend was pushing it more than the sti ;)

[wushucivic]

start from 50 or above and you have a good chance. it all depends on the other driver. i raced and beat a local sti several times from 50mph because he was a shitty driver. he's stage 2 now and beats me, but not like a stage 2 should beat a E36 M3.

[m3chaser]

well, thank you all for the posts so far.

i have not yet had a chance to race this fella yet, but as soon as i get the chance i will!!! i see that someone called me a wuss......not sure why, but you can shut it:D.... no just kidding, i know you were only messin.

i am not sure if you all are reading what i have done to my car, but you need too!!!!!!!!!!!. i have 3.38lsd gearing which should help me out quite a bit. the STI is a faster car than my M3, but i am the better driver in this case and i have a car that is substantially faster than a stock M3.....and it is not cause of the intake and exhaust mods, it's because of the blasted gearing!!!

now, i am rather new here, but nonetheless i still know too read the whole thread and the posts following so that i can get the whole story....i suggest some of you do the same soo that there isn't all this freakin arguement goin on!! there is no way my car is faster then this kids STI, but if he does not know how do drive it, then it should be an interesting race.

the whole point of me starting this thread was soo that i could get an idea of how i should race him and if i had a bloody chance. now then, i am not upset, but some of you need to pay attention and don't just read one or two posts or just the title and then start spouting off with the mouth.

:stickoutt :stickoutt

p.s. this only applies to some of you, and to those it applies too......:D

[skratch]

well, thank you all for the posts so far.

i have not yet had a chance to race this fella yet, but as soon as i get the chance i will!!! i see that someone called me a wuss......not sure why, but you can shut it:D.... no just kidding, i know you were only messin.

i am not sure if you all are reading what i have done to my car, but you need too!!!!!!!!!!!. i have 3.38lsd gearing which should help me out quite a bit. the STI is a faster car than my M3, but i am the better driver in this case and i have a car that is substantially faster than a stock M3.....and it is not cause of the intake and exhaust mods, it's because of the blasted gearing!!!

now, i am rather new here, but nonetheless i still know too read the whole thread and the posts following so that i can get the whole story....i suggest some of you do the same soo that there isn't all this freakin arguement goin on!! there is no way my car is faster then this kids STI, but if he does not know how do drive it, then it should be an interesting race.

the whole point of me starting this thread was soo that i could get an idea of how i should race him and if i had a bloody chance. now then, i am not upset, but some of you need to pay attention and don't just read one or two posts or just the title and then start spouting off with the mouth.

:stickoutt :stickoutt

p.s. this only applies to some of you, and to those it applies too......:D

like i said start at 80 or he will eat you alive.

my friend has an sti and we have raced a few times,I win after 100 and he leaves me anything before that.

I have a few mods and can tell you those cars are f-ing fast as hell.

my mods are
3.38 rear end,uuc flywheel,3.5 intake,acs delete,cdv delete,aa track pipe,aa exh,software,plasma coils,uuc pullies ect

I dont want to ruin your hopes of beating this kid but im sorry even my car had no chance till 90+

start the race at 80 in 3rd he will have no choice but to be in 4th and you should take him to 120 ish from there.If you go from 60 you can forget it:(

[m3chaser]

i will def do what you are saying....thanks for the advice my friend

[SpeedLi///Mit]

I had a run in with a new Legacy GT the other night.. I believe they have the same engine as the wrx ? not sure if they are tuned the same... but we went from about 4 grand in second to about 5 grand in 3rd before catching traffic.. and he hung right with me.. when we let off I had only a 1/2 car length on him.. I have just stromung catback, his car appeared stock.

[SQ Bimmer]

If this kid really sucks badly at driving, why the hell would you want to put yourself into a big huge hunk of metal, travelling at high speeds right next to him, not forgetting that he is in a huge chunk of metal as well?

Take it to the track. You're probably going to lose, but at least at the track the chances of both of you "losing" are reduced.

[RRdawho?]

If your gonna race him, please race him at a strip. I duno bout you, but I wouldn't want to be racing some douche kid w/ a overpowered car that doesn't know how to drive on the streets. :nono

[turbo8765]

It's interesting to me how people talk about how someone "can't drive" in a street race from a roll. What exactly is that suppose to mean? Does he not know where the gas pedal is? Does he not realize that pressing it down makes the car go faster? Ok, shouldn't be that sarcastic, but you're talking about racing this guy from 80. So, as long as he can do the 4-5 shift in the subie, he's done. Granted, some people shift faster than others, but in a race from 80-120, if you win or lose because of one (possibly two if you go way too fast) gear change then you're either driving identical cars or you are literaly retarded. Launching a car is a completely different story. Racing from a roll at a speed where traction is limited is somewhat of a different story, but racing from a 60 or 80 mph roll is barely, i mean barely, affected by driving skill. It's not like there is a tree so you you can cut a better light. You just floor it and shift once, maybe twice. I don't mean to get on a rant, but I've seen a lot of threads where this comes up, and it makes no sense.

In terms of your car vs the subie, as stated above, from a stop it will murder you. But from a high speed roll it is suprising how much the parasitic losses of AWD start to hold you back. If you start out in the top of third, you may have a race but I think will prob still lose slightly.

[mose121]

start from 50 or above and you have a good chance. it all depends on the other driver. i raced and beat a local sti several times from 50mph because he was a shitty driver. he's stage 2 now and beats me, but not like a stage 2 should beat a E36 M3.

So you're beating a STI with 400awhp in an E36 M3? :confused :rolleyes Even with a 3.93 diff you'd get your ass handed to you. If both cars are stock, the STI probably still wins with a good driver.

[mobil1]

So you're beating a STI with 400awhp in an E36 M3? :confused :rolleyes Even with a 3.93 diff you'd get your ass handed to you. If both cars are stock, the STI probably still wins with a good driver.


Since when do STI's come stock with 400awhp?

If the STI is launched properly, you're finished to 100. The 60ft time on AWD is what makes them so fast in a 1/4mile drag.

With that sad, you have a better chance going from a roll. I would say race him from about 30mph where he is at the top of 1st or bottom of second, where hes pretty much useless.

Now, my friends Evo is modded (HKS intake, exhaust, downpipe, walboro fuel pump, larger intercooler, rerouted intercooler piping, and custom tuning) and puts down about 300hp to the wheels. Two days ago we were both at a stop light in a two lane turn lane, the light turned green, we both went to first, then second, waited til the straight hit even, then hit WOT. I actually pulled on him for a good 2 seconds before he hit boost, then he was barely inching up on me after that, but didnt pass me in time before the lanes merged (til top of 3rd). So, the moral of the story is...even though his car is much faster than mine, if you race him from the right speed and gear to take away his advantages, you'll give yourself the best chance to win.

[mose121]

Since when do STI's come stock with 400awhp?



He said stage II, which puts the stock 300hp up to over 400hp if not more. Any stage II STI would whoop up on even a pretty heavily modded E36 M3.


start from 50 or above and you have a good chance. it all depends on the other driver. i raced and beat a local sti several times from 50mph because he was a shitty driver. he's stage 2 now and beats me, but not like a stage 2 should beat a E36 M3.

[m3chaser]

me thinks that wushucivic was only being sarcastic when he was talking about the E36 M3 beating the stage II STI. ummm magazine racing the STI is about a sec faster than the E36 M3 stock for stock in the 1/4 i believe, soo i am pretty sure he was just messin

[SQ Bimmer]

He said stage II, which puts the stock 300hp up to over 400hp if not more. Any stage II STI would whoop up on even a pretty heavily modded E36 M3.
I dunno about you, but I consider "heavily modded" to include FI. There are quite a few E36 m3s on this board that would have much fun murdering an STI. ;)

[OneImprezziveRS]

just race him at the track, or this thread will continue turning into who's faster than whom debate. To me, i don't know exactly what you're trying to prove from a roll,stop or whatever. These cars were designed with turns in mind, so a real race to me would be at an auto-x event to see who pulls fastest lap time. That to me is the real race...it's how you have prepped your car, how much driver skill you have and how well you know your vehicle too.

Maybe i should get a M3 vs. STI auto-x challenge going lol

[mazur]

Maybe i should get a M3 vs. STI auto-x challenge going lol

M3 would woop on an STi through the cones. :)

[OneImprezziveRS]

M3 would woop on an STi through the cones. :)

ya never know ;)

[mose121]

I dunno about you, but I consider "heavily modded" to include FI. There are quite a few E36 m3s on this board that would have much fun murdering an STI. ;)

If you put the same amount of money into an STI that you would to go FI on an M3, the STI would definately still come out on top. A "stage II" STI at around 400-430hp comes at about half the price as the $5-7k you'd spend on the SC/Turbo setup for the M. I can't really believe this topic is even being argued.



M3 would woop on an STi through the cones. :)

There's not doubting that.

[SQ Bimmer]

If you put the same amount of money into an STI that you would to go FI on an M3, the STI would definately still come out on top. A "stage II" STI at around 400-430hp comes at about half the price as the $5-7k you'd spend on the SC/Turbo setup for the M. I can't really believe this topic is even being argued. .
I was talking about an FI M3 vs. a stock STI. No mention of hp/dollar, or even a modified STI. You got way too ahead of yourself here. :rolleyes

[EnzoXYZ]

Stop talking and go find out.

[OneImprezziveRS]

Stop talking and go find out.

Exactly...

[m3chaser]

well i am as soon as i get the chance i will race him, but i do believe i will do as you all are saying and just take him to the track. i do not wish him to drive crazy and kill himself. as you all can see i have not yet had an opportunity to race him, but when i do i will go to the track, or perhaps i will go to a road with nooooo traffic and race him. i am just curious if i can stay with him or how bad i will lose.

i may never know what i can do against a stock STI at higher speeds because of all the risk especially to him. the only way i will race him in the twisties is on a track which he i am sure will not do. i almost never race on twisties cause it is way to dangerous and i do not wish to take another's life because of a thrill( on the street).

once again i was only trying to get a heads up fom you all to see what is the best race for me against a faster car. it seems that another thread has been pissed on by subject changers.

[wushucivic]

So you're beating a STI with 400awhp in an E36 M3? :confused :rolleyes Even with a 3.93 diff you'd get your ass handed to you. If both cars are stock, the STI probably still wins with a good driver.
i don't know how you had trouble with this but i will clarify, i beat him when he was stage 0. now that he is stage 2 he beats me, but not as bad as a stage 2 should beat an e36. as i said in my post he is a shitty driver and that is how i beat him.

[RRdawho?]

Dunno bout STI's but EVO kills M3's left and right at Auto-X, especially where some area allow them to run unlimited boost...the bastards.

[mobil1]

Dunno bout STI's but EVO kills M3's left and right at Auto-X, especially where some area allow them to run unlimited boost...the bastards.


Evo's are amazing on the track. STi's feel like fat shit hogs around the turns.

[Tehvic]

I tried racing a STI on the highway today, but he wouldn't take it. It would have been fun, we were doing about 50...oh well...guess he was intimidated, hehe

[OneImprezziveRS]

I tried racing a STI on the highway today, but he wouldn't take it. It would have been fun, we were doing about 50...oh well...guess he was intimidated, hehe

If he was an individual of early 30's and up, then most likely he was not intimidated, rather just would take it to the track. That's how most STI drivers in that age range think.

[turbo8765]

When you say an STI has stage II mods, this is so non-specific that it really has no meaning. There are so many different paths that can be taken, so many different companies that make parts, and so many different considerations for what each "stage" might consist of. You really have to be much more specific, but I guess that's beside the point.

Did you race the guy yet or what??????

[wushucivic]

When you say an STI has stage II mods, this is so non-specific that it really has no meaning. There are so many different paths that can be taken, so many different companies that make parts, and so many different considerations for what each "stage" might consist of. You really have to be much more specific, but I guess that's beside the point.

Did you race the guy yet or what??????
i'm really not as familiar with scoobies as you might be but from what i know he has a stage 2 map from his utec, downpipe, he might have changed the injectors but i'm not sure. there were a couple other things that he did and he said it was stage 2. i'll try to get a more accurate mod list and post it. as i have said a couple times now, since he went "stage 2" he beats me, but not as bad as a stage 2 should beat an E36 M3. this really isn't that big of a deal, when he went stage 2 he won the race. i don't understand why people have trouble with that? i only beat him when he was stock i.e stage 0. from what i understood the original question was about a stock sti with a shitty driver and i was saying that it was possible for a E36 M3 to beat a stock sti with a shitty driver.

[Boosted2003]

The STI's are cows dude. They are fast cars though. It's just that most drivers don't know the gearing on them well enough to to utilize the powerband. For a new car for $34k, in my opinion, it is one of the safest and fastest cars out there in that price range.

I still think a evo mr is better buy for the money.

[turbo8765]

I still think a evo mr is better buy for the money.

Yup.

[gutbuster]

if you dont hav a chip you cant even pull to 130 ...

not true,, i had mine (unchipped ) to 137

[mose121]

not true,, i had mine (unchipped ) to 137


I don't think "sport models" with vaders had a limiter. Also, even if you did get above it the speedo is probably off at least 7-10MPH above 110MPH. Your dash might have said 137 but it was probabaly 120-130ish according to the rear end. Next time have someone hit the set button on the limit screen. That's more accurate IIRC.

[turbo8765]

My M3 with vaders has a limiter.

[SQ Bimmer]

I don't think "sport models" with vaders had a limiter. Also, even if you did get above it the speedo is probably off at least 7-10MPH above 110MPH. Your dash might have said 137 but it was probabaly 120-130ish according to the rear end. Next time have someone hit the set button on the limit screen. That's more accurate IIRC.
156 mph indicated, 157 mph calculated. This was a friend of mine, pretty damn accurate if I do say so myself!

[skratch]

iv checked mine with a diff calculator and are speedos are pretty accurate

[mose121]

My M3 with vaders has a limiter.

I was mistaken then.

[mobil1]

My un chipped M3 went 142 before limiting down hill.

[Mad Dog 20/20]

Street racing is gay!! Take it to the track!!!!!


Amen.

In my experince an STi will KILL a slightly modded e36 M3 just about anywhere anytime from any speed.

No contest.

[gldntkt]

walked on one to 140 on the highway from 3rd gear....i think that's the only range we would stand a chance. I saw one running at the strip last week and it was pretty impressive.

[UKRBMW]

I just sold my STI and I'm not sure how E36 M3 would beat one short of FI.

From a dead stop it'll be impossible as long as an STI gets a decent lunch, only if STI misses a gear or something.

[M31313]

I have raced 4 STI's, two were from a stop, two from a roll, I smoked em from a roll, and put a few CL's on him from the launches. (The two from the launch were both my friends and were experienced drivers)

[m3teknitian]

I ran a couple STIs on the freeway, both with the same results (I actually recorded one of them, I'll find the video for you guys). From about 65-xxx I slowly gain my lead... At the end (both around 120-130 mph), I'm ahead by at least 1 1/2 car lengths. They just aren't that fast on top end...

I wanna run one from a stop though, even though I know my chances are really slim... (all I'm running under the hood is.. JC CAIS, UUC Pulleys, UUC Stg 2 Ltw Fly+Clutch)

[UKRBMW]

They don't die on the highway, not the same pull as down low, but they don't fade that much. My friend still has his STI with nothing more then a Catback and he raced our friend with E46 M3 and they were dead even upto 145. I don't know how all of you are racing E36 M3s with bolt ons and are walking all over all these STIs.

I had an STI, just sold it less than a month ago, and first hand I can tell you they there is no way you're winning if the other guy knows what he is doing. And I don't even think you'll be faster on Auto-X or the track, those cars are very capable.

[OneImprezziveRS]

They don't die on the highway, not the same pull as down low, but they don't fade that much. My friend still has his STI with nothing more then a Catback and he raced our friend with E46 M3 and they were dead even upto 145. I don't know how all of you are racing E36 M3s with bolt ons and are walking all over all these STIs.

I had an STI, just sold it less than a month ago, and first hand I can tell you they there is no way you're winning if the other guy knows what he is doing. And I don't even think you'll be faster on Auto-X or the track, those cars are very capable.

Agreed.

[joenationwide]

Amen.

In my experince an STi will KILL a slightly modded e36 M3 just about anywhere anytime from any speed.

No contest.

Booooo. :shifty C'mon man....

Im not arguing that with equal drivers the STi shouldn't walk away from a slightly modded E36 M3 in a drag race, but at an auto-x or track day?

At the very LEAST at an auto-x, a slightly modded E36 M3 is EQUAL to an STi, no question. Just check the regional, divisional, and national results in STU. This is where they go head to head, and it's pretty close. Ive beaten and been beaten by STis at an auto-x.

[BAMF]

i used to own one, and with intake and exhaust, i ran 12.5

if you race him from a dig, you might as well start in reverse, they pull 1.6 60 fts on street tires.

i raced a m3 when i only had i/e and walked it by about 6-7 cars by 100mph.

STi's are very fuken fast, and easy (for what it is) to drive, just dont bet him money!

[BAMF]

i just got my m3 about 2 weeks ago and all i have done to it is AA track pipe, and my old STi, (had about 400whp on pump) was soooooo much faster, but no turbo lag is nice now.

from a roll, the added weight of AWD kills you. i raced a vette that ran 12.9's from a dig and put 5-6 cars, then from a roll lost by about 1.

[JDawgM3]

They don't die on the highway, not the same pull as down low, but they don't fade that much. My friend still has his STI with nothing more then a Catback and he raced our friend with E46 M3 and they were dead even upto 145. I don't know how all of you are racing E36 M3s with bolt ons and are walking all over all these STIs.

I had an STI, just sold it less than a month ago, and first hand I can tell you they there is no way you're winning if the other guy knows what he is doing. And I don't even think you'll be faster on Auto-X or the track, those cars are very capable.


Very true, I am an avid track racer here in Colorado. I have a friend with a STI that has only exhaust, and he is able to turn laps nearly 2 seconds quicker than a professional SPEED World Challenge driver was able to in my stock 95 M3. I have not raced him on the street (wouldn't because it is stupid) but have not doubts that his STI would KILL my stock M3. Even with a few mods, it is just out of the E36 M3's league.

Its fairly ignorant to suggest that a good driver in an STI would loose to a M3 unless the M3 has FI.

[magnetic1]

car: 95 cosmos black M3
performance mods: cosmos intake, AA gen.III catback exhaust, 3.38lsd gearing, racing dynamics lowering springs, bilstein sport shocks and struts, uuc ssk.
other mods: demon eyes, M5 rims, sony MP3 playback head unit, VIS carbon fiber hood, clear corners all around.

your 24lb wheels arent helping you achive your goal either... Im surprised no one else picked that up.... :confused

joenationwide... youre prolly running wheels that are 7-10lbs lighter than him... :embarrasm

[shifter]

hey guys, new to the forums. If i get a chance to race an STI i will let you know how it goes. I have a 98' M3 dinan S3 package. Im sure ill woop it.

[mazur]

I have a 98' M3 dinan S3 package. Im sure ill woop it.

If you're lucky to run into a stock STi, then I'm betting $50 that he'll put at least a couple car lengths on you from a rolling start.

[M3Romeo]

13.7 with just an intake? Hmmm, ill pay to see this. STI's are very fast do not sleep on STI's. That's the only car when iam at the light, that makes me think twice about racing. It's hard to tell if they did any upgrades, especially a bigger turbo, then you are really in big trouble :)

[JamesM3M5]

STI's are FAST FAST FAST. I drove my friend's a few times recently, and I think I'd still have a tough time beating him from a roll or a dig, and I've got 321HP.

[m3teknitian]

They ARE fast, so to avoid future flaming, I wanna get that clear. The last STI I raced from 80mph and up, he kept a 1/2 car lead ahead of me just until about 100mph, then I started to gain on him. Maybe all the STI's I've ran into aren't pushing it hard enough? I always figured that the turbo wouldn't help the 4 banger up top, especially against the M3's I-6, but I don't know much about STIs to begin with. I'm just posting from my personal experience with an STI.

From a stop to top speed, I have no doubt the STI will get at least 4-6 carlengths ahead of me. They're just too quick from a stop, and the turbo will definitely kill my NA mods.

[Haifisch M3]

It's interesting to me how people talk about how someone "can't drive" in a street race from a roll. What exactly is that suppose to mean? Does he not know where the gas pedal is? Does he not realize that pressing it down makes the car go faster? Ok, shouldn't be that sarcastic, but you're talking about racing this guy from 80. So, as long as he can do the 4-5 shift in the subie, he's done. Granted, some people shift faster than others, but in a race from 80-120, if you win or lose because of one (possibly two if you go way too fast) gear change then you're either driving identical cars or you are literaly retarded. Launching a car is a completely different story. Racing from a roll at a speed where traction is limited is somewhat of a different story, but racing from a 60 or 80 mph roll is barely, i mean barely, affected by driving skill. It's not like there is a tree so you you can cut a better light. You just floor it and shift once, maybe twice. I don't mean to get on a rant, but I've seen a lot of threads where this comes up, and it makes no sense.

In terms of your car vs the subie, as stated above, from a stop it will murder you. But from a high speed roll it is suprising how much the parasitic losses of AWD start to hold you back. If you start out in the top of third, you may have a race but I think will prob still lose slightly.


:lol +1, agree completely
even the launch (STI) should be something that any 12 year old can do,
AWD, 4500 rpm, drop the clutch and step on the pedal...how hard is that?
From a stop E36M3 has NO chance against STI

[BAMF]

^^ haha NO, 4500 will bog the shit out of that, try 6500-7000

[Haifisch M3]

Are you sure that you aren't talking about WRX?
The STI has a lot more torque

[Jean-Claude]

The only time I got to have at it with a STI is when my brother was following me to a tinting shop 2 miles away from work. On one of the straight aways I floored it knowing he would floor it in his brand new 2006STI. He VERY SLOWLY gained on me from 45-85mph.

He has exhaust, software/psi bump at least. He kinda keeps his car under wraps from me. Doesn't want me knowing what he spends money on, lol!

I have CAI, sharked ecu, exhaust, ltw flywheel/clutch, m50 manifold and pullies.

Once I get my S/C he won't be gaining on anything I have.....:devillook

[jworms]

i just had a run-in with one on a closed off raceway without any other cars *cough* the freeway (but it is late ~1:30am) *cough*. we went from about ~70mph up to almost end of 5th gear. he never pulled away from me and i actually pulled on him, slowly, in 4th and 5th gear. i am not stock (mods in sig) and i don't know if the STI was stock or not, but fwiw he did have aftermarket wheels.

also, i had a passenger (+150lbs), and he was alone.

all in all i am very pleased with the performance of my car. even with slight misses in some gears (needs software fixed, running lean), it pulls so nice all the way to redline.

[rayesc]

Bumping an old thread since I had a chance to spar with an 07 STi recently. Both similarly modded (chip, exhaust, suspension). I failed and left ACS on so it killed my launch and it was obvious that's where the STi has us beat. North of 80 I started to catch up but our off-road stretch of pavement was running out. Post SC install, it won't even be a fair fight :evil2

[NHmfree]

i just had a run-in with one on a closed off raceway without any other cars *cough* the freeway (but it is late ~1:30am) *cough*. we went from about ~70mph up to almost end of 5th gear. he never pulled away from me and i actually pulled on him, slowly, in 4th and 5th gear. i am not stock (mods in sig) and i don't know if the STI was stock or not, but fwiw he did have aftermarket wheels.

also, i had a passenger (+150lbs), and he was alone.

all in all i am very pleased with the performance of my car. even with slight misses in some gears (needs software fixed, running lean), it pulls so nice all the way to redline.

Any weight reduction? If not, nice work.

[jworms]

Any weight reduction? If not, nice work.

back then...probably not. i might have removed the spare tire, but that's it. i was definitely less modded than i am now. probably making somewhere in the neighborhood of 220-225rwhp with a bad tune causing misfiring around 6500rpm.

[wanganstyle]

if the Sti is healthy, catless or 3" high flow + remap, no stock camshaft s52 would have a chance. I have a good friend with an 06 sti, before exhaust and remap, it only pulled slightly on my e36, post its a world of change. Realistically, on mountain passes and some tracks the ability to accelerate due to na vs turbo is pretty even due to delivery and power to the ground.

We did a pull from 10-143 (my v-max) last night, he was quite a bit ahead and probably pulled to about 160 before he let off. My e36 is 3.38+5mt+6430 stock rev limit, s52 with stock intake, stock everything, aa airbox and eisemman back box, stock cats + legal smog car.

If the Sti is stock power.......realistically- who keeps an sti stock power>? you can remap for catless 3" turbo back exhaust using a usb cable and free openecu software.

downpipe+ exhaust+ chip is 60hp and 60 lb-ft. its easy cheap power, only thing better speed/power for money is the EVOlution 8/9

Sti's go from stock 235 awhp on pump 91 (mustang) to low~300's awhp if using waterspray or meth or high octane- stock injectors are maxed out before there, usa tuners do really garbage tunes to them due to our octane, STi's have their own list of powerplant issues as well.

No close to stock S52 powerplant + e36 body would keep up with a stage 2 STi (turboback exhaust+remap ecu) , unless the body was ridiculously light or s52 dry sumped ++

[Volf]

My encounter


http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1332346

[racer m]

nice win in the other thread

[bennyfizzle]

I actually had a tussle with an 05 STi the first summer I had bought the M3, went a couple times from 65ish, being the beginning of 3rd or so up to end of 4th. I had messed around a bit with the car on a 2 lane surface street and ended up at the light, asked the guy what he had as I have a couple buddies with subarus so I know pretty well what mods get you what numbers wise. The exhaust was obvious, and that's all he said he had, catback and cobb accessport with 'stage 1' OTS software. Anyways, we hop on the highway and do a couple runs, each run being the same result with me getting a jump being n/a, and just holding that half car or so lead, with him tapering off ever so slightly before he'd shift (stupid little vf39's :)). The STi's 6 speeds have relatively short gears as well so on the highway he had an extra shift which hurts unless they have some extra power. All in all his front bumper ended up at my back bumper by 120 or so each time we raced. Gave a wave and went on my way.

[torqueflight]

Honestly I have no idea what you guys are talking about. I sold my Stg2 2007 Sti a little while ago. I think most people you are coming across don't know how to launch the car. It's not as easy as you think. If a 505hp Z06 gets left a few car lenghts behind me at launch there is no damn way a e36 m3 is going to hang off the line or in the quarter mile unless it's FI. Hardly any car leaves the line faster than awd. And you better be a damn good driver.

My stage 2 had launch control if I wanted to use it. I could have set it to 5k rpm, put my foot to the floor and all I would of had to do was slip the clutch off the light under 10psi off boost. I'm telling you, nothing with 2wd will come close to leaving the line that hard. But I never used it because I didn't want to break my axles.

I also raced a modded e46 m3 and off the line there wasn't a chance in hell. He would at least 10 cars back from not being able to hook. From a roll I was still a car lenth or 2. The look on his GF's face told me all I needed to know.

I'm not hating. I sold my Sti and kept my e30. There's just something about the Sti that makes it feel cheap and uncomfortable.

Who really cares who wins. Just enjoy your car. There's always going to be something faster than you.

Ps 2007 sti's had a different trans with alot better gearing. They were noticeably faster in the quarter mile and on the highway.

[ImplicitFiber]

i just had a run-in with one on a closed off raceway without any other cars *cough* the freeway (but it is late ~1:30am) *cough*. we went from about ~70mph up to almost end of 5th gear. he never pulled away from me and i actually pulled on him, slowly, in 4th and 5th gear. i am not stock (mods in sig) and i don't know if the STI was stock or not, but fwiw he did have aftermarket wheels.

also, i had a passenger (+150lbs), and he was alone.

all in all i am very pleased with the performance of my car. even with slight misses in some gears (needs software fixed, running lean), it pulls so nice all the way to redline.


Not bad... I kept up with a evo 7 or 8... whichever is the first year.... I was really impressed, but it was at a higher speed

[M3in]

nah guy... i can stay close to the bumper of an STI off the line. id agree with the 65+ mph pull for your advantage... 3rd -4th gear pull. Id like to line up with one of these too


my mods. AA headers, AA track pipe, UUC system U catback, CAI, TMS chip, on 18s. M coupe is probs a bit quicker than me too. I think you can take him if you out drive him... good luck brothaa

maybe a 15 mph roll would be good too.. 1st gear pwr band. just make sure you hook up.

[NHmfree]

nah guy... i can stay close to the bumper of an STI off the line. id agree with the 65+ mph pull for your advantage... 3rd -4th gear pull. Id like to line up with one of these too


my mods. AA headers, AA track pipe, UUC system U catback, CAI, TMS chip, on 18s. M coupe is probs a bit quicker than me too. I think you can take him if you out drive him... good luck brothaa

maybe a 15 mph roll would be good too.. 1st gear pwr band. just make sure you hook up.

I don't think he's launching it very hard. Your M probably goes pretty good with those mods, but I can't see a decent STi driver not being able to pull on you badly from a dig.

[I3MW]

Honestly I have no idea what you guys are talking about. I sold my Stg2 2007 Sti a little while ago. I think most people you are coming across don't know how to launch the car. It's not as easy as you think. If a 505hp Z06 gets left a few car lenghts behind me at launch there is no damn way a e36 m3 is going to hang off the line or in the quarter mile unless it's FI. Hardly any car leaves the line faster than awd. And you better be a damn good driver.

My stage 2 had launch control if I wanted to use it. I could have set it to 5k rpm, put my foot to the floor and all I would of had to do was slip the clutch off the light under 10psi off boost. I'm telling you, nothing with 2wd will come close to leaving the line that hard. But I never used it because I didn't want to break my axles.

I also raced a modded e46 m3 and off the line there wasn't a chance in hell. He would at least 10 cars back from not being able to hook. From a roll I was still a car lenth or 2. The look on his GF's face told me all I needed to know.

I'm not hating. I sold my Sti and kept my e30. There's just something about the Sti that makes it feel cheap and uncomfortable.

Who really cares who wins. Just enjoy your car. There's always going to be something faster than you.

Ps 2007 sti's had a different trans with alot better gearing. They were noticeably faster in the quarter mile and on the highway.

I'm sure there are RWD cars that will leave the line that hard, there's a cool video in OT of a modded CTS-V that pulls .9 Gs off the line. Though I don't think an E36 M3 is faster (I say slight advantage to the STI in stock form) it is decent off the line for 2WD. I don't know how good the driver of the Vette was but its going to be a lot harder to launch than an E36. Not really sure how you could see the GF if you were pulling but I'm pretty sure your car was noticeably faster if it was modded. I agree with the last part, you should really buy your car because you enjoy it, and forget about what other people think.

[M3in]

I don't think he's launching it very hard. Your M probably goes pretty good with those mods, but I can't see a decent STi driver not being able to pull on you badly from a dig.

haha yea he kinda looked a little bouncy... but i felt good about keepin up with him. i think i would have caught him by about 80 but he let off at like 50 ahead by about a car and a half

[95s52]

To put this thing to rest, in a race from a roll say 50-120 a healthy stock e36 m3 should, and in most cases will, put a length on a equally talented driver in an equally stock sti. In a race from slower speeds, say 1st gear @ 30mph, the sti's torque will play a big factor and will shift the result the other way. We all know what will happen in a race from a dig with a properly launched 4wd car..

PS chaser, has this race ever happened?

[rayesc]

We all know what will happen in a race from a dig with a properly launched 4wd car..

PS chaser, has this race ever happened?

That was my experience. Standing start, he took a half car-length lead coming into second gear and kept pulling away. Halfway through second we were at the same speed. Into third gear I started to gain the distance and then we had to let up. Like I said, we ran out of road.

Just some good clean fun. Both cars have their strengths and are desirable for their respective attributes. I've owned both and raced (AutoX, HPDE) with both. I was happy with how the E36 handled itself and will have one of each in the stable if I can find a beater STi.

[MThrizze]

my 99 bone stock barely beat a stg 2 wrx which is comparable to a stock sti. i have owned both a wrx and a sti wonderful cars, a properly launched 4wd car is tough for anything to keep with. when i was around 360 whp launching on 14psi i took of on my friends GTR he also used launch control. after this launch of mine my motor died, the torque from the launch snapped the timing belt tensioner and i bent my nice valves and dented my wieseco pistons:(, fixed the car cheaply and ditched it with the built motor...bought the M and will never look back, subarus take too much damn money and they reward you with blown motors.

[dizzythree]

Is it even possible to hit 150 with a 3.38lsd in an M3?

Depends on what size tires you're running. I've done it with some beefy 255s and my 3.38.