loud clicking in the e34 [Archive] - Bimmerforums

Hypr5

12-28-2004, 05:23 PM

Hello guys, my 1990 525 is nothin but problems today! anyway....

I went to go back out of my garage after checking plugs + wires because of a stumble at 2k rpm and I hear "CLICK CLICK CLICK CLICK" from underneath th ebeast. Well, I have someone help me find where it's coming from and its from the back of the car, underneat - around where the differential is located. (or so it seems) but it only does this under weight. With the car jacked up and in drive, mash the gas.. nothing. Drop it back down and heres the noise again. Not constant either, sort of intermittent, but occurs VERY VERY VERY often.

Any ideas guys?

Thanks a million.

thejlevie

12-28-2004, 06:19 PM

Could what you are hearing be the fuel pump? If you take up the rear seat it should get louder from inside the car.

Hypr5

12-28-2004, 06:21 PM

unfortunately, no. It's definately something that is rotational and under the car. and speeds up as the car speeds up.

And like I said before It doesnt do it without the car sitting on the ground =/

I'm confused :(

JAlfredPrufrock

12-28-2004, 06:43 PM

Do you feel any vibrations in the drivetrain?

Hypr5

12-28-2004, 06:46 PM

at 2k rpm there is quite a bit of vibration - feels like an engine misfire, but... it's not.

side note:WHen it comes on constantly, If i shift to neatral and coast, its gone - comes back when i shift into D though.. =/

Mr Project

12-28-2004, 06:49 PM

Center support bearing
Guibo
Differential mount(s) (most likely)
Rear subframe mounts

Check all these, especially the last 2. Didn't you say a while ago that when you hit the gas the car goes kinda sideways? Probably related, you probably have bushings totally shot to heck back there.

JAlfredPrufrock

12-28-2004, 06:51 PM

Hypr5

12-28-2004, 09:32 PM

It got WAY worse!!

40mph the car shakes so bad it's scary and the clicking is gone.
subframe mounts / differential mounts seem to be okay.
There are no visual cracks or anything that I can see wrong. Do I rally have to remove the entire exhaust to inspec tthe drive shaft components?!?

<sigh>

Thanks for the help guys. Oh - Is there any bpossiblity that the tranny is messed up some how since the clicking went away when I shifted to neutral and returned after putting it back in gear?

Thanks again!

thejlevie

12-28-2004, 10:01 PM

I didn't realize from your original post that the sound was only present when the car is moving. A sound that is speed dependant would have to be coming from a rotational part. One simple possility might be a loose wheel, which could cause the car to shake. After that I'd suspect the driveshaft or a differential half shaft (universals thereof). I guess the center bearing could also be a culprit.

> Do I rally have to remove the entire exhaust to inspec tthe drive shaft components?!?

Pretty much...

Mr Project

12-28-2004, 10:09 PM

Is there any bpossiblity that the tranny is messed up some how since the clicking went away when I shifted to neutral and returned after putting it back in gear?

Rather than being tranny-specific, there's a good chance it's a load-specific problem. As in, it only happens when power is applied. When you put power to the rear wheels, things move and angles change, especially if there are worn-out bushings, bearings, or CV joints.

There's obviously something very wrong back there, and it should be 'findable' by a thorough check. Get it in the air, on solid jack stands, and take a screwdriver/prybar and see if there is play in the rear subframe mounts. Then the same for the diff mounts. Then look for slop in the axles/CV joints. Then the driveshaft.

If you still can't find it, maybe there is somebody in your area that has a good knowledge of automotive suspension/driveline components? Even a friend or BMWCCA member of some kind or something if you don't have the $$ for a 'real' mechanic right now. I wish you were around here, I'm sure we could figure out what the problem is with some prybar and sledgehammer time. :)

Hypr5

12-29-2004, 12:34 AM

I appreciate your guy's help, I know I'm a major pain in the *** with all my questions when my car flips out.

Anyway, I'll get her up on all 4s and see whats up... Any tips for me? Are all the exhaust hanger bolts rusted and stuff down there? <sigh>

Well... thanks again to everybody :)

Robert

12-29-2004, 01:06 AM

Check the transmission tail mounts..

On my 91 535i, after driving alittle the car would make a clicking sound. Faster you go the worse it sounds..

I found out it was the tranny tail mounts getting soft from the exhaust heat. When they get soft, they lower the rear of the tranny just enough for the driveshaft to scrape the aluminum heat shield..

To know for sure if it is this problem, jack the car up, remove the rear half of the exhaust. Then remove the thick aluminum heatshield, the one right below the driveshaft. Check the heatshield for any scratches/scrapes..
Give this a try.

I have a set of automatic transmission tail mounts, somewhat used. I estimate they have about 20,000 miles on them.
If you want I can take some pictures of them. I'll sell them for $10 shipped..

Also check your motor mounts.. If you need a set, I have some slightly used ones. They have about 10,000 miles on them.. New they are about $50 each. I will sell you both for $40.

Let me know if you need some mounts or any other e34 535i automatic parts.
(im currently parting out my 91 535i)

Thanks

Hypr5

12-29-2004, 02:18 AM

Ill check those things out as soon as the rain stops. (shouldn't be longer than 3 or 4 days) and then I'll let you know what's up. Thanks for the advice and offer :)

Mobius20

12-29-2004, 02:24 AM

I have a feeling this is one of those problems that should become very apparent when you get the back of the car in the air.

My bet is a failing CV joint, though.

Robert

12-29-2004, 06:16 AM

I have a feeling this is one of those problems that should become very apparent when you get the back of the car in the air.

My bet is a failing CV joint, though.

Probably right. The sound on my 535i came from the middle of the car.

Hypr5

12-29-2004, 09:45 PM

Today, I didnt have much time, but I got the beast up on ramps and checked out the CVs, Diff mounts and subframe mounts. Everything seems pretty tight. The only thing I noticed bad was the rear sway bar links, they're super dry and the sway bar is moveable easily by hand.

I didn't really have time to remove the exhaust and heatshield, but as soon as I do, I'll let you all know what and if I find anything.

russiamutha

12-30-2004, 12:44 AM

Mobius20

12-30-2004, 07:04 AM

WOW!!! I have encountered the same kind of problem today. When I accelerate to about 40mph or put the car into 4th gear, I can feel clicks through my shifter only. Even if I put it into neutral, the click is still there untill I stop the car. Oh and the clicking becomes more and more frequent as I accelerate, but it could only be felt through shifter, there are no vibrations whatsoever.

Any one have any ideas? Thanks.
You sir, probably have a guibo in dire need of replacement.

It probably does this at lower speeds and heav(ier) acceleration, too - right?

If so, you need to have this addressed pretty quickly. It's close to failing, and when it does, driving the car gets... tricky...

russiamutha

12-30-2004, 12:11 PM

You sir, probably have a guibo in dire need of replacement.

It probably does this at lower speeds and heav(ier) acceleration, too - right?

If so, you need to have this addressed pretty quickly. It's close to failing, and when it does, driving the car gets... tricky...

Thanks for responce, pretty much there is no clicking until I put the car into 4th gear.

russiamutha

12-30-2004, 02:11 PM

Took my car to mechanic today, and found that problem is with flex disk. The disk is pretty much about to go in pieces, it has chunks of ropes hanging out of it and it is badly cracked.

Hypr5

01-02-2005, 04:39 AM

I'm about to jack up the car today or monday and inspect everything. One question though - I'm pretty sure if it's a driveshaft related issue, I'll be able to see it - but how would I know if it's the center bearing??

Cacatfish

01-02-2005, 05:11 AM

Im going with CV joint also....Get somone in the back seat with the windows open and have them hang their head out both sides to see if you can locate which side its coming from.....

After a certain point they can start to bind up worse and get real interesting....

Diff mounts and subframe bushings arent going to be rotational, just clunks when pressing or releasing throttle.

ps: dont be surprised if there are no visual cues, though a torn CV boot would be a good tip off...

Hypr5

01-02-2005, 01:18 PM

Hmmmm.... If there are no visual cues, then I have the same question for them as I did for the center bearing.

How do you make sure thats what has failed?

Cacatfish

01-02-2005, 03:04 PM

Get an ear closer to the sound to figure better where it is coming from...

Hypr5

01-03-2005, 04:57 PM

Robert

01-03-2005, 06:07 PM

Might as well replace it while you are under there..
Also put the car in gear and put the ebrake on. Now go under the car and twist the driveshaft. If it has quite abit of play in the driveshaft, it is time to replace U-joints or buy a new shaft.. I don't remember for sure but I thought you can't replace the u-joints on the factory driveshafts..

You should be able to move the driveshaft up and down about 1/4in.. The rubber in the center being allows it to move alittle.. If you wiggle the shaft around in the center bearing and it moves really freely, replace it.
Any cracks, replace it..

When you pull apart the driveshaft to replace the center bearing, make you you use something good to mark the splines. If you pull the driveshaft apart without marking it, there is only a 50/50 chance you will put it back together balanced..

Make sure you check out the condition of the whole driveshaft, you might need a whole new unit..

If your car is an automatic, I have a low mileage 4hp/22 auto tranny for sale. Rebuilt tranny from the dealer, with receipts.. I got a new driveshaft for sale too..
Also, I'll cut you a good deal on the whole drivetrain. Drop that big M30 into your 525i and add a turbo.. That should put a smile on your face when the car pulls you like a freight train all the way to 160mph.. lolollolol :devillook :devillook
sry, I got carried away again :)

Hypr5

01-03-2005, 06:24 PM

I would absolutely love that, but I dont think I'd be able to put that m30 in there on my own. oh well. Anyway, there are cracks on both sides of the center mount, but I really dont have $100 just to pop it in right now and have it not be the problem. <sigh>

I can move the driveshaft about an inch or so, though...

bah

Cacatfish

01-03-2005, 07:16 PM

You probably wont hear the click with the wheels up since it seems to only happen under load. Start somewhere on an uphill with a guy in the backseat hanging out the windows on either side. You'll get a better idea of the location.

thejlevie

01-03-2005, 07:37 PM

Hey guys - the noise is totally gone so I can not check to see if its the CV's. I did get it on jackstands and got the car to "100mph" and played with several RPM ranges and nothing back there looks off.

However - the driveshaft's center bearing (the rubber all around it) is cracked in several places and you can "shake" the driveshaft by hand. Is this whats causing the vibrations? What do you guys think? Medium pressure with my thumb can move the driveshaft up and down.

That could be it and it certainly needs replacement. And while the driveshaft is out you should replace the flex disk (aka guibo) as well. Be sure to check the driveshaft universals for play and free movement once the driveshaft is out. If there's free play or stiffness in the universals replace the driveshaft or have it rebuilt.

Hypr5

01-03-2005, 08:25 PM

Automatic cars don't have the guibo, do they? Is there anything similar to it?

Also - Would a FRONT wheel bearing shake at all only when power is applied? Sicne this problem started, the passenger side front wheel does not spin freely. bah.

Jsut wondering if I have two things causing a problem here. Common sense tells me that if it was a wheel bearing it would be constant (especially up front) but with these cars I'm always shocked. lol

thejlevie

01-03-2005, 11:51 PM

The auto Bimmer's I've had have had a guibo, but I can't say for sure if yours does or not. It'll be real obvious once the driveshaft is out for the center bearing replacement.

On the front wheel pull the caliper and see if the wheel still drags. That's an easy check to determine whether the resistance is from a dragging pad or the bearing.

Hypr5

01-04-2005, 01:27 AM

at 130k miles, should the center bearing show wear as I have explained or do you guys think something has caused it to wear out like this? Since it is crakced I figure its a good idea to replace it even though it's kind of expensive.

Thanks

thejlevie

01-04-2005, 02:47 AM

I figure on 100-120Kmi lifetime for a driveshaft/center-bearing/guibo. You're just a bit past that, which is within reason. Replacing everything isn't terribly difficult (once you get the exhaust out of the way) or terribly expensive. I think the last it ran about $650/US for all of parts. A rebuilt drive shaft is somewhat cheaper, if the down time for sending it in and getting the rebuilt part back isn't a concern.

At that mileage it would probably also be a good idea to replace the transmission mounts.

Mobius20

01-04-2005, 05:16 AM

Took my car to mechanic today, and found that problem is with flex disk. The disk is pretty much about to go in pieces, it has chunks of ropes hanging out of it and it is badly cracked.
Yep. Thought so. :)

If your shifter is getting knocked around, it's the guibo.

JAlfredPrufrock

01-04-2005, 05:25 AM

If you look under your car and see this:

http://www.we-todd-did-racing.com/wetoddimage.wtdr/wNjUyMzczNnM0MTNkZmQzMXk1NDE%3D.jpg

It's time to replace the guibo.

Hypr5

01-04-2005, 11:52 AM

I have an auto tranny so I feel no shifter vibrations and according to the BMW dealer, I have no guibo. I'm gonna go ahead and get that center bearing overnighted to me since I am borrowing someone's garage and let you guys know. Thanks a bunch.

Bobertsr

01-04-2005, 12:18 PM

The driveshaft center bearing is mounted in rubber so it's supposed to be somewhat moveable up, down, all around. Did you lay eyes on the flex disc (Guibo) at the front of the driveshaft? Common problem and can give weird symptoms, all related to driveshaft viberation.

Hypr5

01-04-2005, 03:16 PM

Because I wasnt in my own garage and I had to use someone elses, I had to put the exhuast back on and move the car outside.

When I did this I went up the street at the speeds I know it shakes at and the shakes were gone. completely. I didnt drive for more than a mile, but... I'm even more confused now.

When I shook the drive shaft around by hand, could it temporarily have re-centered that center mount? I've had it jacked up before and ran the car on jack stands to peak under there, etc. but it never went away after re-lowering it.

:help

btw: I do have a new center bearing on order. Poor car is parked until then.