Cooling Overhaul Question

[Charlemango]

Hey everyone, been lurking these forums for a looong time but finally got an E36 M3 a few weeks ago, so I figured its time to join. I have a cooling overhaul question. There is tons of info about mileage intervals, how to do it, parts etc... But my question is this: my car has 93,xxx miles. It came with records for an overhaul in 2010 at 73xxx miles, 12 years ago now. The mechanic who did the PPI didnt see anything, but it sounds like visual inspection isn't good for much on these. So what does the forum think? Should i be in a rush to overhaul the system? Crazy to drive it until its been done on account of age alone? I know it wasnt always indoors, and summer is pretty hot around here (thinking about old rubber).

Thanks!

[blckstrm]

Congrats!!

You're fine to drive it. Depending on what was done you may or may not need to revisit everything sooner than later. What do the records show? I'm assuming "pretty hot" means St George rather than Salt Lake, so even if you're in tip top shape I'd always be keeping an eye on your temp gauge. I've got a bluetooth OBDII transmitter that use to monitor temps via an app on my phone (Torque). We've written books about this temperature issue, but know that once your needle starts moving you're climbing past 225. So once it starts moving, it's time to take some kind of action to bring them back down (coast, kill the AC, shut the car off - whatever you have to do to cool it off).

You intended usage is also a consideration. If this is a weekend car, just send it. You can always limp home in the off chance something goes wrong. If it's going to be a track car, I'd think more strongly about overhauling it again before doing very much. If it's going to be a daily driver, I'd make a list and prioritize based on what was actually done and what else the car needs.

Personally, there is very little I would do if the 2010 overhaul included a new water pump, radiator, and fan clutch or whole fan. Even then, ANY catastrophic failure gives you plenty of time to shut the car off and pull over before you overheat and cause damage - as long as you're paying just a little bit of attention.

Although 93k miles is low, it's not low enough to justify keeping everything super original. As you decide to update things, some silicone upper and lower hoses will be more resilient than normal rubber. A Stewart water pump is both more robust and flows more water than the stock pump. A Z3M radiator is larger and will provide more cooling, which would be important given your location. Make sure you replace broken plastic ducting parts (or fabricate something) to keep the air moving through the radiator.

[Braymond141]

I disagree and would recommend redoing everything. I highly doubt the 2010 overhaul was done thoroughly.

Unless you are a proficient mechanic, which based on you getting a ppi done I'm guessing you're not, it isn't worth putting yourself in the position to get stuck with a cooling system issue.

It's $600 in parts to refresh the cooling system correctly. Plus a little extra since the correct way requires removing the intake manifold to access the hidden cooling system components. Just replace it, you'll know the exact condition of everything. You can also make the necessary upgrades (included in that pricing) to have a better cooling system and peace of mind.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1cUTnZGxhsn4xIDawJavS3M70YrIlmsNV2VH_ImU5yx4/edit?usp=sharing

[Nova1]

If you are planning to regularly drive the car and venture onto the track here and there, absolutely. You can of course enjoy and drive the car for now but I would start looking to piece together the parts. As mentioned it is not an expensive endeavor and I promise if I can do it, you can, too. I used Braymond's excel file and Sirhodjibob's build on here to help me source parts, the majority purchased from FCP Euro. The 7281 radiator is hard to come by and now I believe the OE is Nissen. I splurged and bought the Genuine BMW version. The 6344 lower hose is backordered with an unknown restock ETA. Honestly, these parts are getting harder to come by so do this while you can still get them.

If you bought a garage queen/investment to drive here and there on a sunny day, you'll probably be fine to just leave the car as is.

[NoLastName]

I'm with Braymond141 - do it all and do it right. On an old e36 it's worth spending the $$ for some level of confidence. All it takes is one weak plastic part or oil-soaked hose to potentially leave you stranded.



You can always limp home in the off chance something goes wrong.

Not always. The plan doesn't work when the old plastic radiator hose neck breaks off and all the coolant blows out in seconds. It happened to me years ago when I bought my first e36. Ugh.

[Charlemango]

Appreciate all the responses, especially Braymond's spreadsheet. Looks like its 3 to 1 vote to be safe and do it. Ill be driving the car every other day (honda fit the others, as I carpool with my wife and she loves her car) and on long roadtrips after I finish sorting her. I have no track intentions at this time, maybe a few auto-x eventually. Sounds like just doing the job is the move, I want to have the confidence to drive 1000 miles.

[scoobiedoo2029]

I'm with Braymond141 - do it all and do it right. On an old e36 it's worth spending the $$ for some level of confidence. All it takes is one weak plastic part or oil-soaked hose to potentially leave you stranded.




Not always. The plan doesn't work when the old plastic radiator hose neck breaks off and all the coolant blows out in seconds. It happened to me years ago when I bought my first e36. Ugh.


+1

expansion tanks like to blow all the coolant out instantly from the vertical crack in the center they all seem to do.

[Charlemango]

Another question; I noticed that the only mention of the fans is in the "upgrade options" category, Ive been looking around and haven't found much specifically addressing whether replacing fans is a standard part of this overhaul, and which fans need to be replaced. It sounds like the cooling fan is a risk of basically blowing up and trashing all my nice new hoses and radiator, and replacing the clutch along with it is wise, is that correct?

If i'm just running this car on the street, am I fine maintaining the OE cooling system design? What is best practice? It looks like I'm wading into a contentious debate here RE going to an electric fan/ keeping the fan clutch. I see a loooot of discussion about electric fans/ AC deletes, specific operating temperatures etc... It sounds like there are strong opinions on whether upgrading the cooling fan system is worth it for a non track car, where I will be doing all of this again on a preventative schedule anyways (sounds like 60k is a common interval for absolute safety?).

So I guess that is 2 questions:
1. replace the cooling fan and clutch with everything else?
2. go to an electric fan worth it for a pure street car?

Thanks for all your input. I love this car, and appreciate how much effort the community puts into spreading the knowledge to keep them running.

[RBNetEngr]

It’s been driven 20k miles in twelve years after a cooling system refresh? I would say it’s safe to drive it, and perhaps have a qualified mechanic look at the cooling system in more depth.

My ‘95 has 67k miles on it. Other than the water pump (replaced with a Stewart pump proactively), an aluminum thermostat cover, and coolant, the rest of the cooling system is original. I’m preparing to proactively replace components now (10/94 Build Date, so 28 years old).

And I’ve tracked in, summer time at COTA in Texas, as recently as 2018.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[scoobiedoo2029]

Another question; I noticed that the only mention of the fans is in the "upgrade options" category, Ive been looking around and haven't found much specifically addressing whether replacing fans is a standard part of this overhaul, and which fans need to be replaced. It sounds like the cooling fan is a risk of basically blowing up and trashing all my nice new hoses and radiator, and replacing the clutch along with it is wise, is that correct?

If i'm just running this car on the street, am I fine maintaining the OE cooling system design? What is best practice? It looks like I'm wading into a contentious debate here RE going to an electric fan/ keeping the fan clutch. I see a loooot of discussion about electric fans/ AC deletes, specific operating temperatures etc... It sounds like there are strong opinions on whether upgrading the cooling fan system is worth it for a non track car, where I will be doing all of this again on a preventative schedule anyways (sounds like 60k is a common interval for absolute safety?).

So I guess that is 2 questions:
1. replace the cooling fan and clutch with everything else?
2. go to an electric fan worth it for a pure street car?

Thanks for all your input. I love this car, and appreciate how much effort the community puts into spreading the knowledge to keep them running.

recent thread on the fan issue. yes they explode too.
https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?2464104-Exploding-Fans-how-bad-is-this-problem-really


plastic condition is massively dependent on storage conditions. if the car has not been a temp/humidity controled enviroment then i would have no confidance in parts that will fail and require a tow.

ive experienced about every plastic failure common on theise cars multibal times. the most eye opening one i have had is the clutch safty switch inside the cabin literaly turned to dust in my hands. granted im at almost 200k miles. ut my car was always garaged untill about 2017 and then it sat in the driveway under a cover and moved in the shop for snow/thunderstorms untill i pulled it back out in 2020 to sort it out out of boredom. my storage conditions where incredibaly bad for plastic. and im paying for it now. however i know better then to have alot of theise issues because i have had them

and the biggest question is when theise parts fail, and you get a tow, what did the tow truck dammage? and are those parts NLA now. this is no longer a modern car. its a vintage car. i spent 10 years looking for a set of matching left and right jaguar etype side mirrors



e36's where designed to be recyclable, mercadies in this era had bio degradable wiring harnesses... there is also the risk of being THAT GUY who dumps coolant on the track/ blind corner and ruins someone else's day.

[Charlemango]

Thanks for linking that thread scoobie, definitely saves me a lot of follow up questions. I'm feeling a lot like Hank in there, regarding the electric fan. It seems like not that simple of a fix to get right, which feels overwhelming right now with all the other things vying for priority. I'd prefer overhauling the whole system, and checking and replacing motor mounts before they go bad to getting into that kind of tinkering at this point. I'm OK at DIY, but nowhere near the level of a lot of people here and dont enjoy the feeling of being over my head on a job. I will say that I've always had to finish my DIYs by sunday night in the past, so being able to take more time with this car will be much better. Maybe I'll be inclined to do the upgrade later but for now I think I'll just replace the fan and clutch with everything else.

[scoobiedoo2029]

Thanks for linking that thread scoobie, definitely saves me a lot of follow up questions. I'm feeling a lot like Hank in there, regarding the electric fan. It seems like not that simple of a fix to get right, which feels overwhelming right now with all the other things vying for priority. I'd prefer overhauling the whole system, and checking and replacing motor mounts before they go bad to getting into that kind of tinkering at this point. I'm OK at DIY, but nowhere near the level of a lot of people here and dont enjoy the feeling of being over my head on a job. I will say that I've always had to finish my DIYs by sunday night in the past, so being able to take more time with this car will be much better. Maybe I'll be inclined to do the upgrade later but for now I think I'll just replace the fan and clutch with everything else.


the changing things is overwhelming, factory design parameters are very well sorted out and these cars are a bit ridiculous engine wise compared to other manufacturers, educated decisions are the only way forward.



any one that dosnt fear a tow hasn't had real sports cars towed from a breakdown. and guess what the e36 is a real sports car now.

[blckstrm]

Should i be in a rush to overhaul the system? Crazy to drive it until its been done on account of age alone? I know it wasnt always indoors, and summer is pretty hot around here (thinking about old rubber).

Thanks!

I still don't think - and I don't think anyone here really thinks - that you would be crazy to drive it until you've overhauled the cooling system again.

Whether you should do it sooner than later - certainly up for debate. And among his many great points, the two most important that Brett points out are that 1) the 2010 overhaul was likely not done thoroughly, which would obviously be the largest concern. And 2) you got a ppi vs doing it yourself, which means my expressed attitude of just enjoying it and catching an issue early may be a riskier proposition.

But at face value, an overhaul done less than 20k ago - and despite the age - is fresh enough to at least enjoy the car a little until you have time to get parts together or schedule getting it into your shop.

...

And if you think THAT'S risky, just contemplate the sheer numbers of soccer moms/dads texting and driving all around you. Or worse yet, simply staring at the touchscreens in their new cars, trying to figure out how to change the radio station or turn on the AC.

If you're willing to risk venturing out in that environment, I think you can stomach risking your slightly old / low-mileage cooling system to go out for a drive.

[Charlemango]

Im planning to do most work myself, but I have never even seen the engine compartment of a BMW before so I figured getting a PPI would be wise. Also since these arent exactly popping up in good condition every day on CL at this point, I appreciated the peace of mind from an experienced BMW mechanic telling me it was a nice car- judgement takes time to develop, and I'm not interested in fixing up a bunch of beaters until I feel worthy to shop for and assess my own e36.

I'll keep driving the car around town until I get to the big overhaul, hopefully next month. Its a little overwhelming making the work plan, as every DIY thread I check alerts me to something else that should be done "while youre in there". Its up to

classic cooling overhaul > should prob do fan and clutch while at it > while its more accessible lets do belts and pulleys and tensioners > I'm removing the manifold, so gotta replace the throttle body gasket > while Ive got the extra room, lets tackle the power steering leak > Oh i should replace the return line with a longer hose so I dont have to repeat the job in 5000 miles > I think thats it- engine mounts maybe over the winter, but the car drives perfect as is tbh. Im a little terrified Ill break a bevy of plastic clips I dont know exist and have to figure out where to find them, but at some point I think Im just gonna have to jump and figure things out.

[Nova1]

Im planning to do most work myself, but I have never even seen the engine compartment of a BMW before so I figured getting a PPI would be wise. Also since these arent exactly popping up in good condition every day on CL at this point, I appreciated the peace of mind from an experienced BMW mechanic telling me it was a nice car- judgement takes time to develop, and I'm not interested in fixing up a bunch of beaters until I feel worthy to shop for and assess my own e36.

I'll keep driving the car around town until I get to the big overhaul, hopefully next month. Its a little overwhelming making the work plan, as every DIY thread I check alerts me to something else that should be done "while youre in there". Its up to

classic cooling overhaul > should prob do fan and clutch while at it > while its more accessible lets do belts and pulleys and tensioners > I'm removing the manifold, so gotta replace the throttle body gasket > while Ive got the extra room, lets tackle the power steering leak > Oh i should replace the return line with a longer hose so I dont have to repeat the job in 5000 miles > I think thats it- engine mounts maybe over the winter, but the car drives perfect as is tbh. Im a little terrified Ill break a bevy of plastic clips I dont know exist and have to figure out where to find them, but at some point I think Im just gonna have to jump and figure things out.

So I’m actually planning to do almost everything you listed in that last paragraph in a few weeks. The power steering can be done at a later date. Unfortunately, that’s just how it goes. Just to add to that list you have there, I would send the injectors off for servicing and replace the throttle cable (more I know, sorry). You will be saving yourself thousands of dollars by doing these jobs yourself. Good luck buddy. We’ll be here to help.

[Charlemango]

Its Pie and Beer day weekend here in Zion, and my wife is out of town, so the front is lifted, I've drained and flushed one time with distilled water, removed the fan, clutch and thermostat, and am now fully committed to 2-3 days (hopefully less) in my 1 car garage. Some thoughts and updates so far:

I got the plastic radiator clips and rivets off without any trouble. I use a wood chisel to loosen plastic rivets, the thin edge is great but definitely need to be mindful of neighboring parts.
The fan removal tool was worth every penny based on what I've heard. That thing came off so easy.
Removing the thermostat: I had to tap my trusty wood chisel in to get this thing out. Why is this so difficult? That was a bit of a surprise.
Thermostat housing: it was aluminum, and the gasket had failed. Looked like it may have been the old 'thingy'. New housing is the poorly cast Uro, with the fatter orange gasket. I almost tricked myself into believing it was the right gasket, but the big thread from 2 years ago showed me the light. FCP failed to include the Elring gasket I bought in my shipment, I contacted them and hopefully I get it before monday ends so I can keep this a 1 weekend affair. I bought this car to drive it dammit!
Old coolant color was pretty good, but there was significant sediment in the thermostat housing and the drained fluid. Glad I'm doing this. There was no crush washer on the block drain, these are the kinds of things I love finding as the new owner of a 25 year old German car. It looks like there is some coolant leaking from the thermo house, and possibly some getting flung off a failing water pump? Im a doomer, so I stayed up last night convincing myself the head gasket is shot. Why else would the car have a new expansion tank and original hoses? I will say this obsession leaves me way happier than the news, climate, economics, the housing market, etc...
I had almost talked myself out of removing the manifold to get the last 3 hoses, but I'm committed to doing it now. I'm slow and cautious, so hopefully I can get it off without needing to replace more than the throttle body gasket at this time. I'm going to do it again this winter to get the rest of the rubber (vacuum lines) under there, do the valve cover gasket (VCG) and service the injectors. Id like to put a couple thousand miles on the car before the salt flies this year, and I wont be able to fully trust it if I don't get those 3 hoses. Learning how to remove the manifold now is just an investment in my future projects I figure.

- - - Updated - - -

Oh a question:

I've been reading about bleeding, surprised to find it is such a headache and that so many ideas are out there. It seems like a lot of people here are now long haulers with the cars; is there a consensus on best way to do this?

[RRSperry]

Bleeding.

With the front of the car raised, (so that the fill is higher than the block), crack open the bleeder screw, pour in coolant into the tank. When it looks full, and quits burping, start the car and turn the heat to HOT, including the center vent. let it warm up and add coolant as necessary. You can feel when the tstat opens because the upper hose gets hot. I give it a few gentle revs and watch. Once things settle down, make sure the level is at or at least close to the HOT line, tighten the bleeder, put on the cap, and shut it off, let it cool down. Next morning, check the level and fill to the cold line if necessary That's all I have ever done and I've never had a problem. (I might be lucky, ymmv)

[Charlemango]

Thanks for the response, Ill try it if I ever get the right thermostat housing gasket. If anyone wanders into this thread with the same kind of questions I'm asking, see this thread about thermostat housing gaskets: https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?2424413-Thermostat-housing-recommendation/page4

FCP Euro screwed me AGAIN, i told them exactly the gasket number i needed, i even see the product # in the support chat record they sent me. What do I receive today? An oil filter housing gasket. At this point I'm starting to wonder if they even have the correct gasket and are hoping I give up... wheres my tinfoil hat... I have the whole car put back together except this thermo housing. Im shaving the fat orange gasket and putting some RTV in there and well see what happens. If it doesn't work Ill post in here and swap with the right one if it shows up.

[NoLastName]

Don't use RTV on the thermostat housing. Wait for the proper gasket.

[Braymond141]

Thanks for the response, Ill try it if I ever get the right thermostat housing gasket. If anyone wanders into this thread with the same kind of questions I'm asking, see this thread about thermostat housing gaskets: https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?2424413-Thermostat-housing-recommendation/page4

FCP Euro screwed me AGAIN, i told them exactly the gasket number i needed, i even see the product # in the support chat record they sent me. What do I receive today? An oil filter housing gasket. At this point I'm starting to wonder if they even have the correct gasket and are hoping I give up... wheres my tinfoil hat... I have the whole car put back together except this thermo housing. Im shaving the fat orange gasket and putting some RTV in there and well see what happens. If it doesn't work Ill post in here and swap with the right one if it shows up.

11531740437?

[ScotcH]

Just go any auto parts store that has a Worldpac supplier ... all the gaskets and shit are there. Or just go to BMW.... it's like a $3 gasket.

[Charlemango]

Braymond- yes that is the gasket. I used your spreadsheet for everything. Question for you- there are two short elbow hoses coming from the heater core to what appears to be a set of sensors; those were not included in your under the manifold section. Is it because they can be wrangled out without taking the manifold off?

I saved myself from myself here. looks (and smells) like i didnt properly reseat one or more of my injectors to the fuel rail, so ill pop off the thermo and put the right gasket in when it comes and try to get her running later this week. Trying to decide if i should order new injector o rings or try to lube up the ones i have and give it another shot.

This has been quite the learning experience. I'll definitely be rigorously checking my orders from FCP when they arrive from now on.

Scotch- Ill hit up Advance later and verify if they have it. I checked my BMW dealers parts, FWIW they said they basically don't carry anything for these cars anymore; I will start price checking them before jobs and well see how long shipping is. The cooling block drain plug they gave me was quite a bit different than what came out of the car too, it had a longer flare between the bolt head and the threads and I didn't want to strain the hole.

[Braymond141]

The two heater core hoses you’re referencing I’ve never experienced a failure from. The others under the manifold that I have listed are known failures.

You’re welcome to deviate from the list. I try to balance risk vs costs to effectively maintain the car.

[Charlemango]

Thats good to know. Maybe ill swap them next time for peace of mind but ill drive happy knowing that. I got the correct gasket and new injector O rings so ill be hopefully finishing this tonight and tomorrow. Having it sitting the extra 4 days helped my spot a expansion tank sensor fitting leak, so I took that out and got it as tight as I could by hand last night.

Lets see if I can post photos now:
706807

My juuuust big enough garage (for front and rear access, Id hate doing suspension in here but I may end up doing the rear end in here anyway next winter):

706808
I was able to get the rotation right on the first picture by flipping and saving, but this one is resisting my best efforts.
Here is my old water pump, showing the slow drip I was getting from the old thermostat housing. Id like to not think about how long this was going on for.

706810

[blckstrm]

The two heater core hoses you’re referencing I’ve never experienced a failure from. The others under the manifold that I have listed are known failures.

You’re welcome to deviate from the list. I try to balance risk vs costs to effectively maintain the car.

That's good to know - I had so much trouble trying to get them off last time I had access (tranny out) I said forget it - and still no leaks. I've been wondering if that was stupid. Glad to hear they're unlikely to leak.


Thats good to know. Maybe ill swap them next time for peace of mind but ill drive happy knowing that. I got the correct gasket and new injector O rings so ill be hopefully finishing this tonight and tomorrow. Having it sitting the extra 4 days helped my spot a expansion tank sensor fitting leak, so I took that out and got it as tight as I could by hand last night.

Lets see if I can post photos now:
706807

My juuuust big enough garage (for front and rear access, Id hate doing suspension in here but I may end up doing the rear end in here anyway next winter):

706808
I was able to get the rotation right on the first picture by flipping and saving, but this one is resisting my best efforts.
Here is my old water pump, showing the slow drip I was getting from the old thermostat housing. Id like to not think about how long this was going on for.

706810

Where are you? I figured you were south because of the high temperature comment, but that picture looks a lot farther north. I've been in Logan all summer - I'd hate to learn you've been just up the street from me all summer when I could have lent a hand.

[Charlemango]

I had to slice and peel of some of the other hoses under there to get them off. I got the feeling I was the first American to lay eyes under my manifold. I'm in SL, so heatwise not like 'was my car even designed for this', but we are pushing 100 for about 2.5 months these days. Send me a PM if you come through town.

[Charlemango]

Car turned over and all the gas stayed where it belonged this time. It was those clips, i learned that i have to seat the injectors to the rail 1st. Some guides said to leave them in the manifold, but i would have to loosen them so much to get the rail clips in that it was just easier to remove them from the manifold. On to bleeding cooling and power steering, one week later. I took the manifold off again twice after finding disconnected vacuum hoses last night 🤦*♂️.

[blckstrm]

11531740437?

I can't find the thread where we discussed this, but I recall either BMW or Elring being OK (and none of the others, including the BMW one that comes with a new housing). Am I remembering correctly?

[Edit] As always, I found it after posting. Yes, this is a correct summary. Here's the thread: https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?2424413-Thermostat-housing-recommendation/page4

Oddly, I have an original kicking around my extra parts bin. But I have no idea how old it is so I need to order a new one.

[Braymond141]

I can't find the thread where we discussed this, but I recall either BMW or Elring being OK (and none of the others, including the BMW one that comes with a new housing). Am I remembering correctly?

[Edit] As always, I found it after posting. Yes, this is a correct summary. Here's the thread: https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?2424413-Thermostat-housing-recommendation/page4

Oddly, I have an original kicking around my extra parts bin. But I have no idea how old it is so I need to order a new one.

You only got half of that right.

The Genuine BMW thermostat housing comes with the oversized junk gasket that I was warning everyone not to use. Do not use it. You must order it separate.

[sirhodjibob]

You only got half of that right.

The Genuine BMW thermostat housing comes with the oversized junk gasket that I was warning everyone not to use. Do not use it. You must order it separate.

I can vouch because I tried using it and the plastic housing cracked when torquing to spec.

[blckstrm]

You only got half of that right.

The Genuine BMW thermostat housing comes with the oversized junk gasket that I was warning everyone not to use. Do not use it. You must order it separate.

Not a worry - I did recall that part, but it wasn't relevant to my situation (I have an old - nice - aluminum housing that doesn't need replaced).

[Nova1]

Can anyone confirm the need for the crush washer/gasket ring (32411093596) for the coolant temperature sensor? I'm quite sure my car has not had one for several years without issue. I've been on my factory radiator for 130K. But, in installing a new 7281 radiator and switch I have added that washer and tried to torque to about 15nm. Any thoughts are appreciated.

[jayjaya29]

its specified in the parts diagram. I've always used one.

[blckstrm]

What is this bracket on the bottom of the Z3 radiator? Is this for the automatic trans cooler? Can I remove it, or should I just leave it?

707607

[RBNetEngr]

What is this bracket on the bottom of the Z3 radiator? Is this for the automatic trans cooler? Can I remove it, or should I just leave it?

The fan shroud usually has a large plastic tab that is inserted in the bracket. It’s probably to prevent the fan shroud from being pushed backwards at higher speeds.

[blckstrm]

The fan shroud usually has a large plastic tab that is inserted in the bracket. It’s probably to prevent the fan shroud from being pushed backwards at higher speeds.

I test fitted and it was interfering with the bottom expansion tank hose, so I cut the rivets and popped it off. Easy enough to put it back with two little bolts if I switch to the euro tank setup (not super likely, though).

[Jim E.]

What is this bracket on the bottom of the Z3 radiator? Is this for the automatic trans cooler? Can I remove it, or should I just leave it?

707607

This is a new euro M3 (Z3 S50B32/S54) radiator? I have never seen that bracket and I purchased two from BMW. Auto trans?? SMG M3 used the same shroud too.

It is not for the shroud. The euro shroud does not attach that way. Uses plastic tabs on the sides. Funny enough there are two holes in the radiator where your bracket used to be.

https://pbase.com/dandoun/image/172902086.jpg
https://pbase.com/dandoun/image/172902084.jpg
https://pbase.com/dandoun/image/172902081.jpg
https://pbase.com/dandoun/image/172902083.jpg
https://pbase.com/dandoun/image/172902080.jpg
https://pbase.com/dandoun/image/172902079.jpg

[Braymond141]

That bracket is not on Mahle/Behr Z3M or OE rads. I'm guessing that is a Nissens?

[blckstrm]

That bracket is not on Mahle/Behr Z3M or OE rads. I'm guessing that is a Nissens?

Yes, it's a Nissens. I'd have preferred the other two but nothing else was available at FCP and I wanted to be able to warranty replace this.

My Mishimoto has threaded inserts in the same location, too.

Doesn't matter - it's gone.

Just need to wait for all the stuff I ordered from Schmiedmann now. While I was doing this I did find my bumper has the holes to mount the splitter - so that's good news. Will make that operation significantly faster.

[blckstrm]

I've had the radiator in for a week.

I had great things to say about it for the first 6 days. I was running significantly cooler than the Mishimoto. Through this afternoon.

Tonight- after the night cooled down - I'm running hotter. I checked the reservoir when I got home and I've burped enough air that it was down just below the cold line. I bled it again briefly and didn't get any bubbles, topped it up, and put it away.

So question - could a strategically placed air bubble at the sensor make it appear to read cooler than actual? Conversely, could it truly have been running cooler and debris from down in the guts of my old engine has plugged cooling passages in my new radiator?

I'm leaning towards option 1. Despite running nice and cool during a fairly hot day today (in fact, I'd say SURPRISINGLY cool), I had a similarly surprising amount of oil light flicker, which previously / normally happens after spending time north of an indicated 208 water temp. After seeing much hotter temps tonight despite it being cooler than it was earlier, it seems likely that there was a bubble or something causing the sensor to be off.

Lastly, I can't use my fan switch as any kind of rough gauge because the water capacity (and therefore delay) is different.

Thoughts?

[Charlemango]

Any idea why my 7000 mile fan/clutch is sounding choppy? It gets loud enough to hear inside the car around 3000 rpm. Just shrug and get a new one? I used the part from braymonds list from fcp.

[blckstrm]

Any idea why my 7000 mile fan/clutch is sounding choppy? It gets loud enough to hear inside the car around 3000 rpm. Just shrug and get a new one? I used the part from braymonds list from fcp.

I would. I always chase down any change in sound because there's a root cause there and I don't believe in just sticking my head in the sand and hoping it heals itself. If it was something you could monitor, I might do that, but there's too much risk with the damage the fan could cause to the radiator.

[Charlemango]

Well its not 100 degrees anymore and it sounds better. Im putting it in my cart either way.

[Johal E32]

Any idea why my 7000 mile fan/clutch is sounding choppy? It gets loud enough to hear inside the car around 3000 rpm. Just shrug and get a new one? I used the part from braymonds list from fcp.

What are the ambient temps? It is normal for the fan clutch to be louder in hot weather. You can also remove it from the car and inspect it for any leaks

[Charlemango]

What are the ambient temps? It is normal for the fan clutch to be louder in hot weather. You can also remove it from the car and inspect it for any leaks

It was 100 F the day it was noticeable. Yesterday it was 87 and I could not hear it.

[Johal E32]

It was 100 F the day it was noticeable. Yesterday it was 87 and I could not hear it.

Yeah, it sounds the like the clutch fan is doing its job. My M5 does the same thing until 3,000 rpm on really hot days while in traffic.