E36 M3 Wheel/Tire suggestions...

[///3oris]

I'm trying to get some VERY sticky tires as I can't hold down the power to the ground my car is making... but, the catch is, I want them to be normal/streetable tires... not DR's or slicks. My current choice is basically S03's (good choice?)

Next issue: I just swapped my 18's out and put on the 17's (Contours)... and WOW, what a difference! The wheel/tire combo doesn't weight less, but since the weight is closer to the center there's a huge difference in feel and now I can't hold any power that I used to be able to previously. The rubber is the same width and the same tire (Cum-ho's... yes, I know... crap tire :stickoutt). Well, I'm still considering a lighter wheel still (such as a Kosei K-1 due to the price)... yet I'm very worried it might cause even MORE problems with holding down the power... even with the new tires.

Can someone please confirm my choice of tires, and make a suggestion on some good light weight wheels that won't break the bank (and won't bend on the first huge pothole I might hit in NYC). Also, the biggest tire I can fit with such a wheel based on offset, etc.

Thanks a lot,

Boris

[Dirty Phil]

if the SO3's seem to be too much in terms of price, go with the Falken GRB FK541 tires, they grip just as well as the SO3, and they are suppose to last longer than the SO3's as well. cheaper, and work the same. the bad thing with the SO3's is that they grip way to well, especially with road hazards.

[///3oris]

Assume price is not an object for the tires...

Thanks,

Boris

[Max M3]

Go with the new Pilot Sport PS2. Michelin has a REAL winner with this tire.... Don't be fooled by the unassuming tread design, the secret to these tires is the new rubber compound. They will be the replacements for my S03's (which I also love).

And smart move going back to 17's. The Contours ARE a little heavier than some other 17's, so if money is no object for wheels too, look into something <20 lbs and you'll feel THAT change too! :D

[///3oris]

I didn't actually mean money is not an object, but I don't want recommendations based on price. That is the mistake I made when I bought my Kumho Ecsta 712's... I'll never do that again. I've never seen/heard of the PS2's before... how do they stack up against SO3's and BFG T/A KD's? Those are my top choices for tires at this point SO3 seems like the best all around tire and I like that it has a stiff sidewall... since I can feel a big difference in turns pre and post 18->17 move.

As far as wheels, I'm seriously considering the ASA AR1's at this point since they have great offset to be able to run some nice wide tires.

Any more input is very welcome... I want to be a 'smart consumer.' I'd rather spend a little more upfront than waste money on things I know I won't like in the future.

Thanks a lot,

Boris

[bimmerdream]

Untill recently I had S03s on my car. I blew one of my rear sidewalls out and decided to upgrade to a all-season tires. After some research decided to go with Falken Zeux(?) 512s... Let me tell you, now I'm kicking myself in the ass, saying I should have spent the money and gone with Michelins Pilot Sport A/Ss. That said, the paragon of performance in my mind is the S03 tire period. Now I'm looking for a all-season equivalent that feels the same or close to S03s I had... Falkens suck! The sidewall is way too soft! Good traction, but SO MUCH body roll! I didn't know what body roll was until I got the Falkens...

Speaking of which, I have 3 S03s for sale. 2 225s and 1 245. Very good tread left, have pics if interested. My $.02

[gerry_miranda]

I've never seen/heard of the PS2's before... how do they stack up against SO3's and BFG T/A KD's?
Boris

Im in the same boat as you. I was gonna put Toyo RA-1 till I found the Pilot PS2. Theyre the latest technology Pilots. If you believe in leapfrogging technology between the Pilot and S03's. Choose the PS2's, S03 is older technology and has been out for a while.

TireRack showed it better than S03s...btw..theyre also lightweight tires compared to S03's, which has a much gretaer affect than lightening wheels, since tires are further out.

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/mi_ps2_nextGen.jsp

[///3oris]

Jeez, you just made my decision even harder! Looks like these are a bit cheaper than SO3's... same tread wear rating...hrm.. interesting option... thanks a lot!

I'll be looking further into these!

Thanks,

Boris

[Spencer]

Boris,

Tire recommendations are pretty subjective. The tires listed below are all solid choices,

- Kumho MX (best grip for your dollar)
- Michelin PS2 (if money is not an object, i'd go here)
- S03
- BFG KD (popular in street tire SCCA auto-x classes)
- Falken Azeni Sports (great tire but poor size selection)
- Yoko A032r (technically an R-Comp tire but can be used on the street)

I would base your decision on budget and tire size. You are going have to be on a track to tell the difference between the top tires on the market today. Some tires might give you that 1-2% extra grip, but you'll never get to that point on the street.

[///3oris]

Tire recommendations are pretty subjective. The tires listed below are all solid choices,

- Kumho MX (best grip for your dollar)
- Michelin PS2 (if money is not an object, i'd go here)
- S03
- BFG KD (popular in street tire SCCA auto-x classes)


Thanks Spencer... I don't care about the last 1-2%, as you said, but I do care a lot about the feel. I actually just looked up more tires on tirerack, and I think the Kumho MX might suit me well as well, since it's up there in grip and is priced much (MUCH!) better.

Thanks a lot for your input... I realize it's subjective, but I might as well try to get as much as I can from the boards since I can't go out and test them all :(.

Thanks,

Boris

[gerry_miranda]

I That is the mistake I made when I bought my Kumho Ecsta 712's... I'll never do that again. Boris

I know the MX are not the same tire but dont repeat the same mistake twice...theyre more expensive....same goes true for wheels.

[Alpine3.23]

I have seen the MXs' blow out a few times
I am a little sceptical about Kuhmo
They are great tires though

[///3oris]

I know the MX are not the same tire but dont repeat the same mistake twice...theyre more expensive....same goes true for wheels.

I coudln't understand the point you're trying to convey... are you saying MX isn't as good of a tire? They're cheaper than SO3's, PS2's, and TA KD's.

Alpine: you have seen them blow out?? Under what conditions?

Boris

[Spencer]

MX's are AWESOME in the dry. Best auto-x/track street tire i've used.

IMO, if you are disappointed with the grip of the MX's in the dry, you still won't be happy with any of the other "max performance" tires on the market.

Then again, this just my subjective opinion... :stickoutt

[gerry_miranda]

I coudln't understand the point you're trying to convey... are you saying MX isn't as good of a tire? They're cheaper than SO3's, PS2's, and TA KD's.
Boris
I know cost (cheaper) does not always relate to quality but...

I have had Kumho's before that I cant balance. Maybe its me but there is nothing worse than vibration for me.

I had Kumho blow out on me on the expressway at 80 mph....

But...its not the MX, Im just dont have too much confidence in the brand...

[MVEED3]

You're not getting traction because you're running the 712s. The S03, MX and PS2 will give you more grip. All are good tires. I remember running some 1/2 worn Avon tires and traction was non-existant. Compound makes a big difference. Don't cheap out on tires, especially on a turbo M3.


Allen

[///3oris]

Oh boy... Avon tires... that's even worse than 712's :)

I was talking to a friend yesterday who auto-x's regularly and he suggested I get Falken Azenis. He said he's had SO3's before and thinks they're overrated... they don't have a lot of grip. Although he did say that when there's a little standing water out the SO3's will plow through anything as if it was dry while the Azenis start floating with a very uncomfortable feeling, etc.

Another friend (who's opinion I very much respect when it comes to this kind of stuff) said the Azenis is a good/sticky tire when it warms up, but they're hard to warm up and usually warm up as you're finished with your auto-x. They basically both suggested I go with Azenis or MX's (which apparently wear out fast, no?).

Anyone else hear of such experience? I was shocked when I heard them 'trash talking' the SO3's...

What's your opinion?

Boris

[Max M3]

The Azinis are about to be replaced with some new model after this year, which should tell you something... Secondly, the Azinis don't come in very many sizes including the correct size for the rear (245/40/17), so that should tell you something too. The MX is hands down better than the Azinis for dry grip according to plenty of auto-xers who have used both.

I will be possibly be moving to MX for auto-x, but for daily use with awesome dry AND wet grip, the PS2's are THE way to go. I even know a few people who are moving to PS2 for auto-x, and if they atart beating me, then I will too!!! :D

[///3oris]

My point wasn't to say that I should get Azenis... it was to say that my friends thought the SO3's sucked... what gives?

All the "BMW people" seem to love the SO3's... yet my friends say they're overrated... :confused

Talk to me, people!! :)

Boris

EDIT: Just an FYI, they drive the Azenis on their daily drivers, not just track or auto-x.

[MVEED3]

S03s are a great tire. I've gone through three sets of them from the street to the track. They're very quiet so they don't give much feedback. You'll have to use them by "feel". And they are on the heavy side but other than that, dry and wet grip is solid. They stay consistent throughout their life and wear well for max performance rubber. I wouldn't hesitate to recommend them to a fellow enthusiast.


Allen

[kylegrant]

the kuhmo mx is the best bang for the buck. great dry traction, wear out in about 5000 miles though.

[///3oris]

the kuhmo mx is the best bang for the buck. great dry traction, wear out in about 5000 miles though.

D'oh, that's not good! I want tires to last at least 10k miles. Considering I rarely push the car, and my Kumho's can probably drive for like 50k miles on my car... do you think the MX's will wear down so fast?

I've seen stock Pilot Sports with few DE days on them that were 30k miles old and still in good shape (few 32's still there). While some people kill tires REALLY fast.

Would you say it depends more on the driver, or what?

What's the USUAL wear on the SO3's?

Thanks,

Boris

[Max M3]

D'oh, that's not good! I want tires to last at least 10k miles. Considering I rarely push the car, and my Kumho's can probably drive for like 50k miles on my car... do you think the MX's will wear down so fast?

I've seen stock Pilot Sports with few DE days on them that were 30k miles old and still in good shape (few 32's still there). While some people kill tires REALLY fast.

Would you say it depends more on the driver, or what?

What's the USUAL wear on the SO3's?


I've run my S03's for maybe 12k miles so far and I'd say they're half done. I just re-mounted the fronts because of the extreme camber I run on the street. They are awesome in the dry (better than the old Pilot Sports) and very stable in the wet. The 2 reasons I will replace them with PS2's when they're done is the high price and the high-tech rubber compound in the PS2's.

My current Pilot Sports are 90% done, and they have been useless for the last 7k miles. Unfortunately they came with the car, so I can't be sure of the total mileage. But even when relatively new, they were no match for the grip of the S03's.

[Bassmaster]

Any opinions on the Dunlop sport 9000's?

Boris what tire size are you going with on the rear.?

[///3oris]

Any opinions on the Dunlop sport 9000's?

Boris what tire size are you going with on the rear.?

I'm not completely sure, but I hope to do 255's at a minimum.

Boris

[M3TurboCa]

Boris I running 17x9 SSR(18lbs) wheels very light weight and up front 17x8(17lbs) I wanted the reduce my rotational mass on my car.

Crap I even took out my spare I know crash zone.

I thinking of running next spring when my Pilot sport needs upgrading the rears to 255/40/17 I have 45+offset.

Up front 235/45/17 this keeps the ride height within .3" and the abs in sync. :)

The FK451 is a older design but a very quiet tire and good wet rating this is what I'm looking at.

[eXpLiCiT]

What about the Goodyear Eagle F1 GS-D3's or the BFGoodrich g-Force T/A KDW 2?

[gerry_miranda]

[QUOTE=M3TurboCa]Boris I running 17x9 SSR(18lbs) wheels very light weight and up front 17x8(17lbs) I wanted the reduce my rotational mass on my car.

QUOTE]

Reducing tire weight has more of an effect than wheel weight. Tire weight are further out than wheel weight.

Just weighed my PS2's

225 45 17 - 21.5 lbs
245 40 17 - 22 lbs

Very light.

[Sammyzuko]

I'd go with the Toyo T1-S's. From what I've read they sound like a great tire with excellent wet traction and they're very light weight. njzprettyboy, who is now a supporting vendor has a good deal on them.
http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=244270

[EEEEeeee36]

I would recommend a set of Yokohama AVS ES100's if you want sticky. I know I'm late but I was searching for something else and didn't know if you are still looking. Also, BBS RC's are bad-ass rims and only weigh 18lbs into 18" rims...less for 17's of course..

[themadhatter]

Boris - if you want to see first hand how light the Kosei K1 is, find me at bfe on Saturday.

-Ron

[themadhatter]

had the toyo t1-s hated it. very greasy tire, vague stearing feel - moved up to the Pirelli Pzero Rosso and haven't looked back - 245/40/17 all around.

I have a nearly new 18" 225/40/18 in my garage with maybe 1,000 miles or less on it. any takers?

-Ron

[SleepRM3]

edsarkiss's setup: 17 x 9 BBS RGR (+42) with 245/40-17 Michelin Pilot Sport IIs all around. He used 10-mm H&R hubcentric wheel spacers up front, but none in the rear. Total weight of wheel/tire is ~40 lbs.

Here are pics of his wheels mounted on his lovely E36 M3/4

http://nobot.2y.net/pictures/bbs_rgr/

He has coilover mods, but I think his car is stock ride height?

[oraph]

i currently have SO3's. It's deffinately an excellent tire for street use... i hve no gripes about it.. But autocross performace left me wanting more..
They got greasy/soft fast.. and were basically very lose after 1-2 laps each session.

now has anyoen ever ran Yokohama ADVAN A-046?

[EEEEeeee36]

I ran Yokohama A520's before and they were sticky compared to most tires I've run.. but that was street. Didn't auto-x them, but I'd imagine based on other tires I tried and ran on the street too that the Yokohamas would only get more sticky... if I recall they had a shorter than average life too, common with softer tires. That's why I'm trying the AVS ES100's next