Update on car

[Bry]

Well, I am taking my car into the mechaninc now. I guess you may have heard, a family member drove my car with the new timing chain tensioner half way in. The car isn't starting.

The mechanic thinks it is an advanced timing chain. Hopefully it isn't anything too bad like bent valves, or a sheared off chain. I have to get a trailer to tow her in.


I'm not very happy right now :(

I will post details of everything that happens. Hopefully we will get her in sometime this week.

[ChrisFL]

Whew. I hope everyhting's A-O-K.


:(

[Hank]

Man you've got such a beautiful car! I really hope it's o.k. and doesn't cost alot.

Now for something to get you're mind off it....

Back in 72, shortly after I'd just purchased my VW Van, I returned home to find that my brother tried to start my bus with a sabre saw blade. Needless to say it stuck in the ignition lock, and I had to R&R the whole steering assembly.

Years later when I reminded him about the time he did that he said "Yea...the devil made me do it"

I hope you get to laugh about it someday, but I know you must be going through alot right now.

Hank

[Bry]

Well, I was doing the install with everything going okay. I got too much tension in the unit, so I tried to find a socket. The socket size is a 32mm and I don't have anything that big. I had to go out and get this socket. I couldn't do it that day because it was getting late in the day.

I told my family not to drive my car, and I put my keys up in my room. Well, to make a long story short, some garage door people came to fix our malfunctioning doors so my father had to back out my car (by hand). Well, unfortunately all the mercury that he played with as a child didn't help his memory, so he completely forgot about the tensioner. He started it up, heard the grinding/slapping, quickly drove my car (wrong thing to do) into the garage and shut it off.

I was really upset at this point. I knew I had the tensioner in there, but still, it wasn't properly in there. Also, it had come apart during shipping, but was still holding tension. I got everything back out (did I mention that it was a PAIN IN THE BUTT to get the tensioner in past the stupid a/c hoses that just happened to be right in the way?) and fixed. I installed the tensioner, tried to start the car, and it wouldn't start, so I took it back out, and tried again. I am positive that I got it in there correctly.

After worrying about the tensioner, I took off the valve cover to inspect the timing chain. Everything looked fine. The chain was very taunt, but wouldn't move. Now here comes something else. My father removed the valve cover, and all the little washers fell into the motor bay! 18 of them... One fell into the motor, down deep. We tried to fish it out, but ended up pushing it further into the motor, so we bought a magnet the next day and tried to fish it out... No luck. (I am going to have the mechanic try to get this out. I don't want to risk anything!).

All of this was going on while trying to fix the tranny output shaft seal-major pain in the butt also. Here is a pic of it.

After putting everything back together, with problems all over the place, the car wouldn't start. It doesn't have the chugging, or the movement. Something is definately wrong. After worrying, we finally called a shop, and we are going to tow it in or rent a trailer and bring it to a reputiable shop.


I thought everything would go flawless too...

I'm pretty sure everything is going to get settled. I don't think the valves are bent, but something is wrong with the chain. I think they will be able to fix it pretty easily. I am getting anxious, my first auto-x is comming up in march, and I need to have my car all set up to go.

Sorry for the long post :eyes1

[Bry]

Note, as you can tell by the tranny, it needed to be fixed! Look at all the spilt oil.

Thanks for the compliments guys :cool:

[JamesM3M5]

Man, that sucks, Bry. My deepest condolences. I had a similar experience with an Evo-2 cam sprocket about 8 years ago. First I dropped two of the bolts down into the engine, but they were caught by the chain tensioner oil reservoir. A magnet got them out. Then the Dinan directions said to "let the chain hang down". Big mistake. When I pulled the chain back up, it rotated the crankshaft vs the cams. I couldn't find the timing mark on the harmonic balancer, so I didn't know that the crank had moved until I got it all together. When I turned it over with the starter, I heard this loud TAP TAP TAP noise. Guess what? Valves into pistons make just about that noise. A trip to the dealer and $500 later fixed the problem. Resetting the cam/crank timing took the guy several hours, but none of the valves were bent! It also turns out the cam gear bought used from the Roundel Classifieds was a regular gear, not an Evo-2. This wasn't the root of the problem, it just added insult to injury. Live and learn!

Hopefully the car isn't starting because it's flooded! If you start then quickly shut down an M3 or M5, they will most certainly be flooded, and you have to remove and dry the plugs thoroughly to even consider starting it again.

I'm betting that the timing chain has NOT jumped a tooth anywhere. The chain isn't long enough to do that even with the tensioner completely gone. BMW designed it that way!

The easist way to check for bent valves is to check for excessive valve clearance. Just like when you do a valve adjustment, slip in a feeler gauge between the shim and cam lobe. If it's way over 0.020", you may have a bent valve. Spec gap is 0.011" - 0.013". Also, a leakdown test will confirm if your engine is simply losing compression from worn rings or if it is bent intake or exhaust valves.

JamesM

[Bry]

I hope it isn't a flooded motor problem. How could I test this? I don't have a spark plug tool to remove the plugs. Wouldn't the motor shake even if it was flooded? The starter just makes a whirring noise (I have it on video on my computer) but the motor doesn't shake.

I want to test and see if it is a flooded problem, because it does smell flooded (ie, smells like lots of gas). When I get the plugs out, how should I dry/clean them?

[Bry]

Also, what should I use to get the plugs out? I don't have a spark plug tool, will a socket + extension work? What size would I need.

The problem would be pulling the spark plug out of that long tube without it falling.


Thanks for the help!

[JamesM3M5]

Sounds like you have a few troubles all at once. First have the car jump-started to see if that shocks the starter into compliance. Since the starter is only making a whirring noise, it could be from a low battery or a bad starter. Jump-starting will eliminate a low battery problem. If that doesn't get the starter engaged, try tapping it with a hammer, not too hard, though. If the starter still does not engage the flywheel, then the starter must be rebuilt or replaced. The "Bendix" (they invented it) causes the small gear on the starter shaft to fly out and engage the flywheel. This Bendix is either stuck or the starter isn't turning fast enough. The starter will eventually engage if you keep trying, it doesn't usually go completely bad all at once.

To remove the plugs, you must have either an 11/16 thin walled socket or an 18mm thin-walled socket. The Ultimate Garage sells the original BMW shop tool (not like the one in the trunk) for $38. The original BMW tool from the trunk is not worth the cost unless you are a Concours competitor. You can buy an 18mm spark plug socket from Sears or other tool store and have it machined down. BTW--NGK plugs are 18mm and Bosch plugs are 11/16" (17.4mm). Some 11/16" sockets will not fit over the 18mm NGK plug. Get an 18mm plug socket just in case your engine has NGKs.

Once you have the plugs out, either unplug the engine computer or find the main relay behind the plastic cover behind the coolant reservoir. With the plugs out and computer disabled, crank the engine over for a few seconds to clear the excess fuel out of the combustion chamber. Clean the plugs off with carb cleaner spray and dry them. Reinstall and plug the computer back in. Make sure the battery is fully charged, then attempt to restart. If it sounds like it's going to fire up but does not, it is probably flooded again. You have to do it all over. Next time, unplug the AFM before restarting. If it's REALLY cold outside (I don't think you have that problem in TX), the engine will actually idle without the AFM. If it's not that cold, the engine will not start when the AFM is unplugged.

JamesM

[Bry]

Thanks very much for the reply James! I think you are talking about the main relay to remove? Is it this one in the picture?

I have one last question, when I was removing my valve cover, a washer dropped down in the motor, down the timing chain area and landed on a little ledge. After trying to get it out, it was pushed under the chain. I don't know if it fell into the sump, or is still sitting there, but a magnet couldn't get it out. What would be the best thing to do? Could I even consider leaving it in there?

Thanks very much for the help!

[JamesM3M5]

Leaving the washer in there is a tough call. If you can take a pic of the cam chain area and point to where the washer fell, that would help. There is a small area in the tensioner area where oil pools. This is where I dropped the bolts, but luckily a magnet did get them out. If a washer made it all the way into the pan, you could remove the lower pan and see if it's there. It will only take about an hour and a new gasket is under $20. If you have not installed an oil pan baffle, now would be the time.

Your picture of the relays is right. The metal-body one is the 5-prong main relay. Buy a spare one, because when they go bad, the car doesn't run. Common problem on cars that are getting 10-12 years old. An Euro auto parts store that sells Bosch stuff should have them in stock, under $10 or $15.

Removing that relay will disable the engine computer which in turn disables the fuel pumps and the ignition coil. This is good when you're trying to dry out a flooded engine. If you just remove the plugs and leave it open for a while, that does just about the same thing. If you're in a hurry, cranking the engine with the plugs out and the ECU disabled will dry the engine out in a few cranks.

So what's the latest update?

JamesM

[Bry]

I'm not going to be working on the car until this weekand. I don't have the time right now.

The little washer dropped on a little ledge, but then went under the chain, which I could not get to. I've allready done a baffle job with a new seal and everything about a month ago. I don't want to leave that ring in there, I may take the valve cover back off, and try some more.

My battery is dead, so I am going to charge it on a trickle charge and see if it holds its charge with my battery gauge. If it doesn't-new battery time.

Thank you for all your help!

[Bry]

Okay, I tried everything. The car is going into the mechanic to be fixed on monday. Thank you for your help, unfortunately the car is still doing the same thing.

I hope to get this fixed soon. Not having my car really hurts:az:

[Bry]

And shes off! I'm sad to see her go :bawl