LED Headlight Bulbs

[nate2k5]

I know this should probably go in the lighting section but I wanted to see what experiences E39 owners have specifically.

Does anyone have CREE LED headlight bulbs? Any pics? How is the spread with non xenon headlights?

[BavarianE31]

Bad idea. Looks "cool" but LED add on bulbs like that are illegal. You'll blind people. That's because the headlight reflector bowl is specifically designed for a traditional bulb and will not conform to a LED source. You'll also get a terrible cutoff. Additionally, although bright, LED's don't project very far unlike their HID cousins. Finally, LEDs suck at color rendition (ie CRI - Color rendering index). Typical ones are around 60-70% of true sunlight. That means you'll see either washed out white or blue or even green. High CRI (aka HCRI) LEDs are expensive and suffer in lumen output (and thus marketing punch cause most uninformed people would rather buy a 3000Lm LED rather than a 2000Lm one every single time) and therefore are not used in these illegal kits.

http://static.bhphotovideo.com/explora/explora/sites/default/files/cri.jpg

Trust me, seeing green tint all of the time will get so, so very annoying. In conclusion, don't buy them. They just look cool and they'll cost you in tickets. Some examples:

http://img.alibaba.com/img/pb/510/052/538/538052510_138.jpg
http://www.ogaled.com/cache/images/201312/20131230154981598159.jpg

[cwise12]

As Bav e31 said, you're not going to be happy with such a setup, and it will be illegal and unsafe. There are many, many reasons not to do this, and very few reasons it would be beneficial at all. LED headlight technology is still quite new, and requires expensive headlight modules that are designed entirely around the use of LEDs - these use totally different reflector/lens setups than our e39s have (or any car with a traditional filament or xenon bulb, for that matter).

The optics in our headlights 'expect' the light to be coming from either the filament of a halogen bulb or the arc of a discharge bulb, which both are similar in size and location. This is illustrated by the photo below, which shows how the light inside a shielded projector is directed. When you put an LED bulb in there, the location and direction of the light changes a ton, making that crappy output we're talking about.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_zl3ewJYv63g/TDW8rZCKbPI/AAAAAAAAA-0/6oMn_irb4g0/s1600/Headlight_projector_schematic.png

Currently, about the best you're going to do in an e39 is a set of high-quality projectors, such as Evo-XR's, FX-R's, or a Nissan/Infiniti/Acura projector, such as RVAE has in his touring. Good projectors paired with high quality bulbs and good ballasts will give you killer, legal, safe output. leave the LEDs for the new BMWs. Can't really beat this:

http://i663.photobucket.com/albums/uu351/bilinvic/Retrofit%20Headlights/EVOX_R2013F150_02.jpg

[SpeedsterBek]

If you want LED headlights, then buy a car that already comes with them (new toyota corolla, various bmws, mercs and audis)

If you have to have LEDs on your car, then you can change your fog lights. Retrofit source has a good deal on F15 X5 LED fogs.
You can probably retrofit them into OEM E39 foglight housings.

I have them on my e34, and the light output of those fog lights are excellent. I also like how they instantly turn on, compared to Xenons.

[Plattus1000]

I used LEDs for reverse lights, work great. Also used an LED for the angel eyes and have been very happy with them.
http://i326.photobucket.com/albums/k402/Plattus1000/Mobile%20Uploads/20140512_235035_zps4691c325.jpg (http://s326.photobucket.com/user/Plattus1000/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20140512_235035_zps4691c325.jpg.html)
OEM on the left, LED on the right

As for the Foglights, a cheap $26 set of 35w HID kits off eBay took an hour to mount, swap out bulbs and enjoy.
I did the same on my touring but used 55w bulbs (cost a tiny bit more)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/261130743261...witem=&vxp=mtr
much brighter and I haven't seen any heat issues to date. They've been in the car for 6 months and I run them every night.

[cwise12]

why
As for the Foglights, a cheap $26 set of 35w HID kits off eBay took an hour to mount, swap out bulbs and enjoy.
I did the same on my touring but used 55w bulbs (cost a tiny bit more), much brighter and I haven't seen any heat issues to date. They've been in the car for 6 months and I run them every night.

HID's in the fog lights are an exceptionally bad idea - the fog light housings on your 540 are not designed for an HID bulb, and will throw light up into oncoming traffic. It's inconsiderate, unsafe, and illegal to have your fog lights equipped that way. Read more: http://www.danielsternlighting.com/tech/bulbs/Hid/conversions/conversions.html

[Plattus1000]

CWISE12
I disagree. The heat from a halogen bulb verses these is about the same. (I was concerned with that too so I tested them to make sure there were no problems)

As for the glare, if you have clean glass on your lights, and I do, the throw out is right where it should be and it is. I've never been flashed since installing these and so I'll assume you just had a bad experience with people not aiming them right or you live in Switzerland.

Inconsiderate and unsafe... First, I'm a champion of consideration. I hold doors open, let people merge and never tailgate or stay in the left lane unless I'm passing so it's a concern of mine how these migh effect people.
Secondly, unsafe? In what world is more light unsafe? I can see the ice and snow I'm driving over now. I can see the faded lines on blacktop on a rainy or snowy night now so I don't risk drifting into another lane.

I hear your concerns and although you can be right, not in my case and not by trying it yourself I'll assume.

When HID lights first came on the scene I recall how annoying they were to me. You could spot them in a stream of oncoming traffic a mile away. You get used to it and now I hardly care/notice when a large SUV or truck is behind me with them right in my mirrors.

I didn't go purple or yellow, I went 4200k which matches the xenons and Angel eyes.

Now, the high beam setting on my 735i, that was insane. Completely stock, it was like daylight infront of my car at night with those things. That was unsafe only if I forgot to switch to the low beams.

- - - Updated - - -

I'll assume that Daniel Stern has an alternative reason for bashing these things. Perhaps the manufacturers of the light bulbs he sells for didn't appreciate the cheap Chinese companies selling the vast majority of the HID kits and the competition. Or he might just trust the government to regulate his lights, I do not.

The reflectors in the fog lights focus a beam from the halogen bulb's filament and the arc from the HID bulb sits in almost exactly the same place so does the vast majority of the beam, throw-out.

The plastic housing on my xenon headlights isn't special and I see no vents to release hot air. While I'm sure that some applications of HID's in a stock halogen housing can be problematic, I have them in mine and do not have any heat issues.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/261130743261?item=261130743261&viewitem=&vxp=mtr This is the exact kit I installed and I LOVE THEM!

[cwise12]

CWISE12
I disagree. The heat from a halogen bulb verses these is about the same. (I was concerned with that too so I tested them to make sure there were no problems) This is correct. If you think about it from an energy perspective, they must make less heat - they are making more light for less wattage, and the ballasts are not 100% efficient. Therefore, less of the energy the bulb dissipates goes into heat.

As for the glare, if you have clean glass on your lights, and I do, the throw out is right where it should be and it is. I've never been flashed since installing these and so I'll assume you just had a bad experience with people not aiming them right or you live in Switzerland. Clean lenses do help a lot with reducing glare, but this doesn't fix the inherent design of the fog light's reflector. It does focus the light into a wide, flat beam, but if you've ever pointed one at a wall, you know there's a lot of scatter up/down from that central "fan" of light. With a 2,000lm bulb this isn't enough to seriously glare other drivers, but when you put a 3200lm+ hid bulb in there (BTW, your company's claim of 4500lm is total crap, even the best bulb on the market running at 55w can only make around 4200lm), that brighter light source equates to a higher intensity of scattered light. All the extra power doesn't make it to the road.

Inconsiderate and unsafe... First, I'm a champion of consideration. I hold doors open, let people merge and never tailgate or stay in the left lane unless I'm passing so it's a concern of mine how these migh effect people.
Secondly, unsafe? In what world is more light unsafe? I can see the ice and snow I'm driving over now. I can see the faded lines on blacktop on a rainy or snowy night now so I don't risk drifting into another lane. Not unsafe for you; unsafe for others. Good work being so considerate to others.

I hear your concerns and although you can be right, not in my case and not by trying it yourself I'll assume. I put HID's in the fog lights of the wagon for a few days, and decided that they produced way too much scatter to keep. I currently have HIDs in my fog lights, but not in standard reflectors - I custom-made fog light units based around Morimoto Mini H1 bixenon assemblies. These keep the light where it should be and allow me very precise aim of the light. See here: http://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?2034979-Retrofitted-Bixenon-Projectors-into-my-M-tech-Fog-Lights!

When HID lights first came on the scene I recall how annoying they were to me. You could spot them in a stream of oncoming traffic a mile away. You get used to it and now I hardly care/notice when a large SUV or truck is behind me with them right in my mirrors.

I didn't go purple or yellow, I went 4200k which matches the xenons and Angel eyes.

Now, the high beam setting on my 735i, that was insane. Completely stock, it was like daylight infront of my car at night with those things. That was unsafe only if I forgot to switch to the low beams. You should see my current setup - daylight is the only word to describe it. Yet - all of my lights are appropriately shielded and aimed to reduce issues for oncoming traffic.

- - - Updated - - -

I'll assume that Daniel Stern has an alternative reason for bashing these things. Perhaps the manufacturers of the light bulbs he sells for didn't appreciate the cheap Chinese companies selling the vast majority of the HID kits and the competition. Or he might just trust the government to regulate his lights, I do not. I don't claim to know much about Daniel Stern's site - but I can tell you that his headlight aiming guide (http://www.danielsternlighting.com/tech/aim/aim.htmlis one of the most comprehensive and widely referenced resources on the matter. As far as the government regulating lighting - there are reasons DOT certifications exist. I'm not saying that every rule is particularly intelligent or important, but if people didn't have to follow the rules we'd all be blind, super dark tinted tail lights would be A-OK, and there would be a lot more accidents at night.


The reflectors in the fog lights focus a beam from the halogen bulb's filament and the arc from the HID bulb sits in almost exactly the same place so does the vast majority of the beam, throw-out. This is true on high-quality bulbs, for the most part. Don't expect such exact alignment of the capsule to the base from a $40 ebay set.

The plastic housing on my xenon headlights isn't special and I see no vents to release hot air. While I'm sure that some applications of HID's in a stock halogen housing can be problematic, I have them in mine and do not have any heat issues.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/261130743261?item=261130743261&viewitem=&vxp=mtr This is the exact kit I installed and I LOVE THEM!

See replies above in red...

[Plattus1000]

Opinions are like... Something. Regardless, I'm keeping mine, the lights and the opinion but that's what forums are for, to allow people to discuss, disagree and or support ideas.

My fogs are bright and don't scatter much light beyond where I want it. Speaking of Switzerland, LED interior lights are illegal to install if the car didn't have them stock. Mostly for "safety".
I call BS on a ton of regulatory measures. I'm not removing the custom exhaust, the staggered wheels, the tint, the sirius radio, the dinan CAI, throttle body, plenum, the smaller side mirrors, the front and rear bumpers or the software flash. I probably should if my perfectly safe fog lights are such a danger and inconsiderate addition.
As stated before : Since August they've been on and I drive over 89 miles over a mountain pass each way. Nobody, has ever flashed me to indicate that my lights were too bright, glary or otherwise. I on the other hand can see the road perfectly and think the the sky is indeed not falling.

- - - Updated - - -

http://i326.photobucket.com/albums/k402/Plattus1000/Mobile%20Uploads/20150208_181623_zpsoun6pwxv.jpg (http://s326.photobucket.com/user/Plattus1000/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20150208_181623_zpsoun6pwxv.jpg.html)
Just low beams.
http://i326.photobucket.com/albums/k402/Plattus1000/Mobile%20Uploads/20150208_181634_zps6g8aqi6w.jpg (http://s326.photobucket.com/user/Plattus1000/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20150208_181634_zps6g8aqi6w.jpg.html)
Low beams and fog lights. Y'all be the judge.

[JimLev]

Very interesting........Chris, I'm going to try them out. Will let you know what I think when the car comes out of garage queen status this spring.
The Tribeca fogs may get them too. I can always switch back if I don't like them.

[theWalkinator]

Eric The Car Guy installed CREE LED headlight bulbs in his 92 Acura and he is pleased with the results:

http://youtu.be/NddUhGVI7EA

And here is another guy who tested CREE LED headlights outside in dark and the light output is improved significantly over his OE headlight bulbs:

http://youtu.be/Q4f0eSmOn4g

I am consider to try this on my other car which has terrible light output with regular halogen light bulbs.


Very interesting........Chris, I'm going to try them out. Will let you know what I think when the car comes out of garage queen status this spring.
The Tribeca fogs may get them too. I can always switch back if I don't like them.

I am interested too so please do post results after you try them.

[jc43089]

I have cree 9004 (high/low) in my 4th gen maxima. The light output is good, I wish the color wasn't so white but the light pattern is good in the oe reflector housings. Only thing I have noticed is that on high beam it doesn't have much more distance. This might be different on a car with separate high/low bulbs.

[theWalkinator]

I have cree 9004 (high/low) in my 4th gen maxima. The light output is good, I wish the color wasn't so white but the light pattern is good in the oe reflector housings. Only thing I have noticed is that on high beam it doesn't have much more distance. This might be different on a car with separate high/low bulbs.

Really?! That "other car" I am talking about is my 4th gen 96 Maxima with glass lens. Where did you get them? Post some pictures please. Thanks.

[jc43089]

I have some pics, got them from a vendor on r3v. Mine has plastic lenses, where did you get glass ones? I will try to post pics tomorrow.

[phillip75]

I have fitted a 3200lm cree led headlight set (http://www.ledlightinghut.com/3200lm-cree-led-headlight-lamp-bulb-set.html)to 530 with no problem AT ALL i didn't have any problems with dip or full beam mode or bulb errors or burning out. The kit works well because the bulb is covered handily by the front bulb deflector that goes completely over the front of the bulb so the light doesn't bloom out or dazzle.

[Coach J]

Bad idea. Looks "cool" but LED add on bulbs like that are illegal. You'll blind people. That's because the headlight reflector bowl is specifically designed for a traditional bulb and will not conform to a LED source. You'll also get a terrible cutoff. Additionally, although bright, LED's don't project very far unlike their HID cousins. Finally, LEDs suck at color rendition (ie CRI - Color rendering index). Typical ones are around 60-70% of true sunlight. That means you'll see either washed out white or blue or even green. High CRI (aka HCRI) LEDs are expensive and suffer in lumen output (and thus marketing punch cause most uninformed people would rather buy a 3000Lm LED rather than a 2000Lm one every single time) and therefore are not used in these illegal kits.

http://static.bhphotovideo.com/explora/explora/sites/default/files/cri.jpg

Trust me, seeing green tint all of the time will get so, so very annoying. In conclusion, don't buy them. They just look cool and they'll cost you in tickets. Some examples:

http://img.alibaba.com/img/pb/510/052/538/538052510_138.jpg
http://www.ogaled.com/cache/images/201312/20131230154981598159.jpg

STFU 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂🤣🤣😂😂🤣🤣😂😂🤣🤣😂😂🤣🤣😂😂 GTFOH Karen

[crdiscoverer]

Why are you posting such a dumb, childish reply on a thread from 2015?

[Jason5driver]

Yeah , Karen ...

[BimmrMeUpSnotty]

C’mon guys, you can’t fix stupid, this is the same guy who didn’t know how to properly check his oil not too long ago on another thread that he started. Before that, years and years ago, he also claimed his catless, straight pipe made his 540 sound just like an F1, well, I knew somebody that did exactly that, yeah it was loud, it sounded kinda cool, but for me, 5 mins of that crap, it would get real old, real fast. And my buddy that did it? Constantly pulled over by the cops, constantly paying the fines. Nothing to see here, move on….

[sleuth255]

Interesting resurrection though. LED technology has progressed a lot since 2015 especially in the areas of CRI. Is there a reasonable LED replacement that works with a stock BMW projector now?

[BimmrMeUpSnotty]

Morimoto has some crazy high priced LED’s you can choose from, let us know! :)

[crdiscoverer]

Interesting resurrection though. LED technology has progressed a lot since 2015 especially in the areas of CRI. Is there a reasonable LED replacement that works with a stock BMW projector now?

We have come a long way indeed, but LEDs are still not ready for primetime when it comes to projectors.

I like this website: https://www.bulbfacts.com/ and they have tested the recent Morimoto (GTR - same folks who manufacture Morimoto), Philips Ultinon and some of the cheap Amazon brands. The TL;DR is that somewhat counterintuitively, almost all LEDs work better in reflectors than projectors, they always lose way too much brightness in the latter. Also follow Sergiu Gabor on YouTube, he posts great unbiased reviews.

I just bought a set of Osram NightBreaker bulbs for my Pathfinder (H4 reflectors). They are great but they only enhance the deficiencies in the stock reflector, so I'm considering an HID projector retrofit like I did with the E39.