'85 Autotransmission problem?

[gamitavo]

Hi All,

I have an E24 '85 US spec with an automatic transmission. Recently, I began feeling the car have trouble, like, catching the gear, mainly at drive off. I feel as if it skids and finally catches on, sometimes it even shakes a bit. I am now feeling it a lot more and now have noticed it on higher gears.

Could this mean an auto gearbox problem? One mechanic told me it could be lack of oil in the box. I have heard that changing the oil on an automatic transmission is really delicate, and shouldn't really be done, I believe I read it in the manual, but I have also seen it somewhere else that it is a recommended change.

I appreciate the input!

[pthm]

if you weren't in costa rica I would say I have a 4 speed and driveshaft that you could buy :)

[Sansouci]

Despite what your mechanic told you, the autobox should have a fluid and filter change every 30,000 miles. The filter change is necessary to clean out the sump of metal and friction material. Eventually, the valve body which controls shifting should be rebuilt to replace springs and check balls.
I've heard the stories of autoboxes failing after a fluid change and it is sometimes due to a worn checkball becoming loose in the VB.
When the fluid is changed, be sure to use the recommended stuff. Get an OEM filter, not an aftermarket which are substandard.

Last point. The concept of "Lifetime" fluid is actually the "life of the warranty" so that BMW could show low ownership costs and minimize warranty claims.

--Ken

[gamitavo]

if you weren't in costa rica I would say I have a 4 speed and driveshaft that you could buy :)

:) Does this mean I should begin to say goodbye to my transmission?

[mauryc]

How many miles on the tranny and how many miles since last tranny oil change? If you don't know the answer to either of those, do a fluid and filter change. Not a flush, just drain and replace the proper amount. you could have just a sticking valve body, or you could be seeing the beginning of the end. WRT the "lack of oil" comment, what does the dipstick read when in gear? Is the fluid bright red or dark red with a burnt smell. all first level things to look at........

[gamitavo]

Thank you! So the symptoms I described are consistent with a need to change the oil? I have no idea on answering your questions, the odometer isn't working, hasn't been since I acquired it in 2011 and it was stopped at about 130K

[dwal95008]

Take it out for a drive if you can, or at least warm up the transmission. Then as mentioned leave it in D and check the fluid. Anything but clear red fluid is a bad sign.


Edit: dont get out of the car with it in gear!! Have a buddy keep his foot on the brake.

[mauryc]

Not saying your symptoms are specific with the need for a fluid change, however that's about the only thing you can do from home as a solution. Clogged filter and poor fluid quality can cause issues in valve body, slippage, etc. Get a clean filter and fresh fluid in there and see what happens....

[Dash01]

Go on YouTube and watch videos on cleaning BMW transmissoon valve bodies. It's not hard, only a few more steps than changing the filter, and not expensive. Water gets into the transmission fluid over time, and so some gunk and corrosion builds up, the little check balls won't move properly, and shifting is delayed. Clean and flush with all new fluid of the proper type and weight, and you will be amazed how well it shifts and runs.

[Sansouci]

One more point: you have a choice on the valve body: buy a rebuilt one from many suppliers or do it yourself. If you do it your self, attention to detail and rely on a shop manual from ZF or ATSG-Automatic Transmission Service Group.
--Ken

[gamitavo]

Hi all, thank you for the help!!

i did not make it back home from work That day, the transmission went out, the mechanic is opening it up to see how serious damage is. Question, is it worth fixing, replacing, or better to go with manual swap once and for all?

[Dash01]

Hi all, thank you for the help!!

i did not make it back home from work That day, the transmission went out, the mechanic is opening it up to see how serious damage is. Question, is it worth fixing, replacing, or better to go with manual swap once and for all?

Well, see if it has proper fluid, and top off if necessary and see if that fixes it.

Otherwise, given the generally high cost of automatic transmission repairs, if you can swap the manual transmission (with driveshaft, pedal box, master and slave cylinders, etc.) in at some reasonable cost, I'd spend the money on the swap. Nobody particularly wants the automatic anyway, but most enthusiasts love the manual, so go that route.

[gamitavo]

Thank you Dash!!!

any recommendations where I can find the all that manual kit and what options can I have in terms of the models that will work well for it?

- - - Updated - - -

Also, I want to turbo it in the future, so if that changes in anything I appreciate the suggestions!!

[Dash01]

Thank you Dash!!!

any recommendations where I can find the all that manual kit and what options can I have in terms of the models that will work well for it?

- - - Updated - - -

Also, I want to turbo it in the future, so if that changes in anything I appreciate the suggestions!!

Best source for transmission swap would be an E28 or E34, if you can find a wrecked one with all the parts in good condition. E24 is essentially a two door version of E28.

First, though. find out what is wrong with your automatic transmission and what it will cost to repair, then compare approximate costs of repair vs. replace with 5 speed. Of 5 speeds, I have read that the 265-5 version if preferred over the 260-5. Others here will know more than I.

[Blazinnate]

Sorry if I hijack a little bit here, seems like a good thread to ask. I have an 88 635csi, and just a couple days ago I noticed a pretty healthy leak from my trans. Today I crawled under there and noticed it was leaking pretty bad out of the inspection window right under the torque converter. Any ideas what could have failed?

[Dash01]

Sorry if I hijack a little bit here, seems like a good thread to ask. I have an 88 635csi, and just a couple days ago I noticed a pretty healthy leak from my trans. Today I crawled under there and noticed it was leaking pretty bad out of the inspection window right under the torque converter. Any ideas what could have failed?

Is the leaking fluid red ATF or brown engine oil?

Either you have a front trans. seal leaking red juice, or a rear engine seal leaking brown juice, or both. Not a fun project either way, as you must drop the tranny to get to either or both seals. While you have the tranny out, best to replace both seals, which are themselves not expensive--it's the pita labor costs that kill you. Also, may as well plug in a rear trans. seal while you have that thing laying on the garage floor. And clean the valve body, changing the trans. filter along with new ATF.

BTW, while you have the tranny out, check the mounting bolts and nuts for the starter motor, and consider gluing the nuts in place while readily accessible, if the E24 is as much trouble to rebolt the starter motor as is the E36, etc.

[Sansouci]

If you want to know what the parts cost, check europeantransmissions.com and California transmission supply (www.theectsc.com) Add shipping to you and labor will get you a rock bottom cost estimate. The valve body rebuild kits are separate from the trans rebuild kits which include steels and friction parts often called "banner" or "master" kits that have most of the typical parts. They may not include the drums which have failed that are ordered from a ZF dealer (such as europeantransmissions or www.thectsc).
Let us know what your mechanic finds.
--Ken

[Blazinnate]

Its definitely tranny fluid. I grew up around mechanics, but always leaned more toward the paint and body side of things, actually went to wyotech for that, and worked in a small custom shop for a few years. I know enough mechanically to r&r stuff, but never have gotten much into the troubleshooting side of things. Before I got it up to take a look. I was really hoping it was something simple like the pan gasket. I've done enough I know I could drop the trans and do it myself, just don't have the time! Thanks though, I'm more ok with a seal leak, than something that would require a trans rebuild.


Is the leaking fluid red ATF or brown engine oil?

Either you have a front trans. seal leaking red juice, or a rear engine seal leaking brown juice, or both. Not a fun project either way, as you must drop the tranny to get to either or both seals. While you have the tranny out, best to replace both seals, which are themselves not expensive--it's the pita labor costs that kill you. Also, may as well plug in a rear trans. seal while you have that thing laying on the garage floor. And clean the valve body, changing the trans. filter along with new ATF.

BTW, while you have the tranny out, check the mounting bolts and nuts for the starter motor, and consider gluing the nuts in place while readily accessible, if the E24 is as much trouble to rebolt the starter motor as is the E36, etc.

[gamitavo]

Hi All,

What would be the ballpark cost for a manual transmission swap to 265/5? I am being offered a 265/5 manual transmission to do the swap for $2,000 including labor costs. If this is a reasonable number in the US I would consider it a reasonable price here as well.

The guy has two to offer, one from an 1989 5 speed 6 and the other from a 1988 M - I don't think it matters if they are both 265/5 right? Both at the same price.

thanks!

[n2bimmer]

Hi All,

What would be the ballpark cost for a manual transmission swap to 265/5? I am being offered a 265/5 manual transmission to do the swap for $2,000 including labor costs. If this is a reasonable number in the US I would consider it a reasonable price here as well.

The guy has two to offer, one from an 1989 5 speed 6 and the other from a 1988 M - I don't think it matters if they are both 265/5 right? Both at the same price.

thanks!


If $2,000 includes all material and labor then yes its a good price.

[88m53453]

the 89 might be a problem as it won't have the holes for the sensors in the bell housing that your 85 requires. I do not think it has a removeable bell housing as well .

[alpinacsi]

The guy has two to offer, one from an 1989 5 speed 6 and the other from a 1988 M - I don't think it matters if they are both 265/5 right? Both at the same price.

thanks!

Not to say that the trans have not been replaced but neither of these vehicles were supplied with a 265/5 or /6 trans. The 265/5 as you have mentioned him to have is a desirable trans to many people as it is the close ratio sport trans also known as the "dogleg" due to the location of 1st gear being down to the left below reverse. Not a good match to your car unless the diff ratio is also changed.

Generally the 5 spd that was used in the 89 e24 from the factory would have plugs covering the holes for the speed and reference sensors but there were very few of these cars available and if the trans was swapped in: you need to verify that it will accept the sensors. The M car would have come with a 280 trans and is also an expensive unit.

I would clarify what your mechanic actually has to offer as the price for the turn key project is reasonable depending on quality of parts and workmanship.

[gamitavo]

Thank you! Is it possible to find in this forum someone selling the full kit to do the swap? I'm thinking the price they're quoting me might be high, and I don't trust very much the origin of the transmission since, at most, there are 10 E24s in the country...

[alpinacsi]

http://www.mye28.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=135575&sid=d29e2b299a4d918d4912ac99f00b65c6