Failed Rear Swaybar Bracket

[ViolinARC]

Is there a size difference for the Sport vs. Non-sport versions? I'm seeing two different sizes for the bushings...13mm and 14mm. Which one is correct? :dunno:

It's just not clear which I should use so I felt forced to order both. The endlinks were toast as well. Guess that's what happens to the old, tired components after replacing the failed ones with new...

[JimLev]

Depends if you have a sport or non sport.
The OEM bushings are so soft you could use the 13 mm ones for a 14 mm bar.
They would hold the bar better.
You should get the $4 E38 steel sway bar brackets, they won't pull out of the top mount hole.

[ViolinARC]

Depends if you have a sport or non sport.
The OEM bushings are so soft you could use the 13 mm ones for a 14 mm bar.
They would hold the bar better.
You should get the $4 E38 steel sway bar brackets, they won't pull out of the top mount hole.

WTF?!? $4 ea...:eek: The ones I ordered from FCP are $51 EACH! Do you happen to have a p/n for me Jim? It would be greatly appreciated...

The bracket didn't pull free from the top clip but sheared off at the bend near the bolt holes so coming loose at the top isn't the issue. However, for the difference in price, I'll prolly just order the E38 brackets and eat the return shipping on the solid platinum ones! :devillook I find it REALLY interesting that the very basic steel brackets are $51 ea. but the beefy OE end links (Lemforder) are only $25 a piece...:confused

As for the bushings, I ordered both sets...13mm and 14mm to avoid being in THAT situation. They are the regular old rubber bushings but I'm running stock sport suspension and guess that the difference is going to be minor. I guess if I HAVE to return the uber expensive brackets, I could return the soft rubber bushings too...sigh.

Do you think that I will notice the difference if I use poly bushings (14mm) instead? The only ones I found were sourced from one of the Baltic states but I searched using DuckDuckGo...maybe I should try Google? :help

[Highfive99]

WTF?!? $4 ea...:eek: The ones I ordered from FCP are $51 EACH! Do you happen to have a p/n for me Jim? It would be greatly appreciated...

Here ya go. 33506779734 Jim pointed me down this road last year. And yup $3.95 a pop from my local stealership.

[ViolinARC]

Here ya go. 33506779734 Jim pointed me down this road last year. And yup $3.95 a pop from my local stealership.

High5 Brutha...thanks for the p/n. Obviously it's the same part, right? Why is there such a crazy price difference? Do I have to modify anything? Seriously :confused because it seems too good to be true...

[carlova789]

They recently upped the price. Even my mechanic get's them whole sale around that price.

[ViolinARC]

They recently upped the price. Even my mechanic get's them whole sale around that price.

Which price man? $51 ea. or THIS? (http://www.eeuroparts.com/Parts/PartResult.php?search=33506779734&_action=AllVehicles#axzz2vEqJLin7) I'm still in shock at the price difference...:eek:

Looked up that p/n on RealOEM (http://www.eeuroparts.com/Parts/PartResult.php?search=33506779734&_action=AllVehicles#axzz2vEqJLin7) and after running a search, found the $4.24 price on eEuroparts.com. I think I'm gonna order them right away cause after looking at the RealOEM diagram, can see that they are the same friggin part...still in shock! :mad

[JimLev]

$51, OMG what crooks!

http://home.comcast.net/~jimlev/Eibach_3.JPG

http://home.comcast.net/~jimlev/Eibach_4.JPG

[ViolinARC]

This (https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/bmw-sway-bar-bracket-rear-33506779734) comes up when I enter that p/n at the FCP site. States in BOLD red banner that "this part does not fit any of your vehicles" to discourage someone who has entered in their y/m...interesting tactic! Guess they cost a LOT more to make the E39 brackets out of PLATINUM! Jesus, this is really pissing me off! They sell the E38 brackets for $3.81...are you f'in kidding me?!?!?!?!?!? :mad I'm gonna stop recommending FCP if this is how they do business...

It's pretty obvious from your pic Jim, that they don't know what the hell they are talking about...

[aspensilver540]

I wouldn't blame FCP, it takes some experimenting from someone like Jim to figure this stuff out. Another forum victory.

[ViolinARC]

I wouldn't blame FCP, it takes some experimenting from someone like Jim to figure this stuff out. Another forum victory.

Yeah...just shocked. Actually, after digging a little bit more, discovered that the bushing for the E38 is 10mm vs. the E39 at 13mm or 14mm so that COULD be the reason FCP states that the SBB for E38 won't fit E39. The price difference still seems outrageous to me for 3-4mm of steel...uhm, aluminum?!? (<--Edited)

Hey Jim...are you absolutely positive that the bushing has to be trimmed for either SBB? Just asking because it seems that trimming material from the bushing might defeat the bushing's intended purpose. :dunno

[JimLev]

That was the polyurethane bushing that came with the 18mm Eibach bar that I needed to trim. If you use the OEM rubber bushing it should fit.
Even if it's a hair too big it's rubber and will compress, unlike the poly bushing.
I trimmed the poly bushing with a hacksaw. Put it in the vise, it took all of 20 seconds to do.
The bushing is there to prevent wear from the bar rubbing on the metal and for noise isolation. Trimming it won't effect anything.

[topaz540i]

I use powerflex urethane bushings.

[ViolinARC]

That was the polyurethane bushing that came with the 18mm Eibach bar that I needed to trim. If you use the OEM rubber bushing it should fit.
Even if it's a hair too big it's rubber and will compress, unlike the poly bushing.
I trimmed the poly bushing with a hacksaw. Put it in the vise, it took all of 20 seconds to do.
The bushing is there to prevent wear from the bar rubbing on the metal and for noise isolation. Trimming it won't effect anything.

Nice to know Jim...much appreciated info (especially the 18mm). I added the E38 SBB's to my order since it hasn't shipped yet and will obviously be returning the uber expensive E39 SBB's. I feel like I should send you the difference but instead will direct you to check your feedback. :cool

[JimLev]

Thanks, my first feedback score, cool.
While the cash difference would be some nice beer money thats not necessary. We're all here for the most part to help each other save money and spread knowledge.

[geargrinder]

Fwiw i didnt trim the bushes for my rear eibachs... Seem to be fine. Havent broken a tab yet but wont be surprised if i do, prob should shell the $8.

[Flounderasu]

Please update with which bushing you end up using (13 v 14).


Yeah...just shocked. Actually, after digging a little bit more, discovered that the bushing for the E38 is 10mm vs. the E39 at 13mm or 14mm so that COULD be the reason FCP states that the SBB for E38 won't fit E39. The price difference still seems outrageous to me for 3-4mm of steel...uhm, aluminum?!? (<--Edited)

Hey Jim...are you absolutely positive that the bushing has to be trimmed for either SBB? Just asking because it seems that trimming material from the bushing might defeat the bushing's intended purpose. :dunno

[ViolinARC]

Please update with which bushing you end up using (13 v 14).



Update as requested...14mm bushing. I have a sport package so I get the 14mm sb.

Also couldn't get the darn E38 sbb bolt holes to line up. Is there a trick or secret? I'm willing to pull the UBER expensive E39 sbb's again if I could get the ultra cheap E38 ones to work.

I used vice grips to bring the e38 sbb to the mounting point cause it was impossible to manually compress by hand. It was at that point I could clearly see the bolt holes were misaligned.

Also note that the E38 sbb is steel vs. aluminum, has one side "arm" a bit shorter and the tab is shorter in width. The E39 sbb also had a rubber pad on the tab...

E39 SBB w/14mm bushing...
http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/aa49/ViolinARC/IMG_20140319_154827_zps9fbe25da.jpg

E38 SBB with a smaller tab.
http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/aa49/ViolinARC/IMG_20140319_154944_zps0f4e81c8.jpg

Goodies for the 5'er...
http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/aa49/ViolinARC/IMG_20140319_155038_zpsd06ea7b3.jpg

Febi Germany...Made in China!
http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/aa49/ViolinARC/IMG_20140319_155230_zpscd794ebe.jpg http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/aa49/ViolinARC/IMG_20140319_155428_zps0234e63a.jpg

SNAP! And beat after almost 195k...not bad.
http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/aa49/ViolinARC/IMG_20140319_161732_zpsa810687e.jpg http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/aa49/ViolinARC/IMG_20140319_161826_zps6b9dd0b0.jpg

Side-by-side...subtle differences.
http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/aa49/ViolinARC/IMG_20140319_165405_zps22844f0f.jpg

FIXED! :thumbup:
http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/aa49/ViolinARC/IMG_20140319_175656_zps9dc2a3cc.jpg http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/aa49/ViolinARC/IMG_20140319_175734_zps7e2975a2.jpg http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/aa49/ViolinARC/IMG_20140319_175919_zpscb927eab.jpg

All-in-all...an easy DIY and I definitely feel less body roll back there. :cool

[JimLev]

So did you trim the bottom of the new bushing like I did in post #8 or use your old bushings?

[ViolinARC]

So did you trim the bottom of the new bushing like I did in post #8 or use your old bushings?

Neither man...I used new German/Chinese 14mm rubber bushings. Is trimming the bushing going to make up for the shorter E38 sbb "arm"? :dunno

[JimLev]

Made in China bushing? WTF.
The bushings that are stiffer will flex less and result in less lean.
That's why I trimmed the poly bushings that came with my Eibach bar.

[pleiades]

The steel e38 brackets didn't work for you? Those (33506779734) are the same brackets on practically every BMW -but- the e39. I was thinking of buying a pair myself. Local dealer is probably as cheap as it gets, no shipping to pay. I see some places (bmwmercedesparts, thebmwpartstore etc) selling them for 2.5x - 3 bucks each. All the vendors have the e39 version priced at least 45 or more. Pelican has those at $67 today ... EACH!!!

BTW, I have a 15-mm M-sport RSB from a 540i on my 528i. I just squeezed the 13-mm rubber bushings on it and bolted in the brackets. I used a little CV moly grease in the hope the 13-mm bushings won't be too tight. Think I should get the 15-mm bushings? The rubber seems pretty soft, honestly, but I don't know if that is good justification to keep the 13-mm in there when the bar originally used 15-mm bushings....

[ViolinARC]

Ok...gonna give it another try this week cause I realized the end links were not secure when attempting to line up the bolt holes. Maybe that will line things up...

The 14mm bushings are REALLY snug (also used silicone cv lube) and I couldn't imagine trying to stuff the bar into the 13mm. I have the 540 sport, maybe it's a 15mm rsb?

[pleiades]

Ok...gonna give it another try this week cause I realized the end links were not secure when attempting to line up the bolt holes. Maybe that will line things up...

The 14mm bushings are REALLY snug (also used silicone cv lube) and I couldn't imagine trying to stuff the bar into the 13mm. I have the 540 sport, maybe it's a 15mm rsb?

Well only a 2-mm diameter difference here. The Sport and M-Sport II bars are 14- and 15-mm, respectively.

You are trying to install with the wheels loaded, right (on ramps)? Suspended from jackstands, wheels hanging, makes this much tougher.

[auaq]

Interesting. I upgraded my rear sway bushings from 13mm to 15mm OEM's yet still using the original brackets and not the steel ones. Looks like I've been doing fine for quite a long time now. It surely makes a huge difference in anti-roll when going around corners as the car feels so much stable and flat too.

[pleiades]

I am probably worrying too much. Last week put the 15-mm bar on my standard suspension 528i and feel that it's just what the car needed.

[auaq]

Oops, also forgot to add the 15mm sway bar upgraded from the stock 13mm.:shifty

[ViolinARC]

I def have the 15mm rsb.

The rear susp was in the air so I will try to line up the sbb's bolt holes with susp loaded. Thanks for the tip...it may save me $80! :cool

[JimLev]

The easiest way to get the clamps bolted to the subframe is with the both ends of the bar disconnected from the links or the links disconnected from the lower swing arm. You can then freely move the bar in any direction needed.
Suspension loaded or unloaded doesn't matter, both sides need to be the same, either weight on the wheels or both wheels hanging when you connect the links.
Using the polyurethane bushings that came with my 18mm bar I couldn't get the bottom of the clamp even with the subframe until I trimmed my bushings as they don't compress at all. Had to do the same thing on a Highfive99's car when we did his 18mm bar.
Don't worry about the shorter width of the steel tab, it's much stronger than the longer aluminum tab.

[pleiades]

.... both sides need to be the same....

JimLev, in my experience on these forums, you are the guy to trust.

I've only changed RSB bushings on two cars, ever, though, and in both cases, I had backed the car up on ramps and had no trouble. In fact, the BMW was "too easy" compared to my Subaru, but that's probably because the Outback RSB required some extra contortions just to get the bar into position.

Somewhere I had read that it's harder with the wheels dangling, but I confess, no experience with that.

[geargrinder]

Somewhere I had read that it's harder with the wheels dangling, but I confess, no experience with that.

Depends on the car. On all cars the swaybar should be unloaded when suspension is loaded (edit: AND level I should say), but some cars can load the swaybar a bit when jacked up (aka if the control arms drop way far down). In that case you mount the bar w/ car in the air. Then drop the car down (or put it on ramps instead) and hook up the endlinks. I don't remember the 540 being any trouble whatsoever when I put the M5 bar on and that was on jackstands IIRC. I have the Eibach now, think I had somebody put that on for me because they were doing some other stuff anyway.

[Jason5driver]

Here is a great thread regarding the E38 rear sway bar brackets that Jim made:
Jason5driver, E38 Sway Bar Brackets (http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?1896991-Jason5driver-E38-Sway-Bar-Brackets)

[pleiades]

Here is a great thread regarding the E38 rear sway bar brackets that Jim made:
Jason5driver, E38 Sway Bar Brackets (http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?1896991-Jason5driver-E38-Sway-Bar-Brackets)



I guess for me there is a line between wanting stiffer brackets (the steel ones on e38s and non-e39 models) and wanting brackets that will probably snap before something aluminum on the subframe cracks.... I'll stop obsessing about this, but think I'll still go ahead and buy a pair of the steel ones before BMW aligns the pricing with the e39 versions.

[ViolinARC]

Hey guys...I didn't have any trouble at all installing the E39 sbb's with the 14mm bushings or the end links with the suspension "unloaded". I only encountered an issue with the E38 sbb's, which wouldn't line up with the body frame mounting holes while the rear was "in the air" and the wheels were off so the suspension was "unloaded", correct?

I am going to use ramps and try to attach the E38 sbb's while the suspension is loaded. Hopefully this will solve the alignment issue with the bolt holes without trimming the bushing (I'd like to avoid trimming the bushing if possible).

I will update my experience with this technique for the E38 brackets as soon as I get a chance to revisit the task (possibly midweek cause the rear sb is an easy task imho) and hopefully, will successfully get the less expensive brackets on board. Thanks for the input and suggestions, it is all greatly appreciated! Bf.c members are wicked helpful and I'm proud to be an E39 owner/member! :buttrock

[ImTheDevil]

The rear was "in the air" and the wheels were off so the suspension was "unloaded", correct?

Correct - unless the weight of the car is compressing the suspension, it's unloaded. Putting it on the ramps will likely help a lot.