Stop oil pressure warning

[devoulley]

Can anyone tell me why I am getting a stop oil pressure warning. I am using 0w 40 synthetic and it seems as if I am burning through it like gas. Every few days I get this warning. I don't drive but a few miles each day and usually only a few blocks at a time. I don't have any major leaks so I am confused as to why I get this warning. Any ideas?

[Geralt]

Do you get the message "Check Engine Oil Level" afterwards when you turn off the engine?

[Qsilver7]

According to the owners manual...if you get this warning...check the oil level...and if the oil LEVEL is fine...then you need to schedule some time (immediately...or stop driving the car) to take a look at the system because something is DEFINITELY wrong. It could be a number of things, like a failed oil pump or loose oil pump bolts, etc. ...your car is telling you that something is seriously wrong...you could wind up seizing your engine if you keep driving it.

http://www.bimmerboard.com/members/q/original/RED%20Brake%20Light%20Warning%20.jpg

[devoulley]

No

Is there a way to test whether or not the pump is good or bad

[Geralt]

Oil pressure test or take off your oil pan and inspect the pump.
I would inspect it first.

[99 IS Coupe]

Take it in...do not continue to drive the car!

You're loosing oil pressure here, and that cannot be attributed to external oil leakage. Especially if using oil, you have something farily major going on there. Better not to try and self-diagnose this one.

[mordor110]

If you're using oil and there are no leaks, it must be going out the exhaust pipe, look for smoke in your rearview mirrors, should you end up driving the car again. (not recomended)

[ELA]

I currently have this problem, been having for about a month and a half intermittently (after hard braking, fast acceleration, quick left or right turn) and now, for sure to come up after 30mins of engine running. I did most of the troubleshooting tips I've read in this forum and others but oil lamp still flickers and "STOP! Oil Pressure" still shows right after conditions I listed above.
I wonder is anyone can give me an answer... I know of two temperature sensors in the engine compartment, one besides the radiator attach to lower hose "Temperature sensor, Coolant" and the other is attached to the OFH "Temperature sensor coolant / oil".
Questions: (I not trying to be confusing but my questions are stacked)
1. The temp gauge on the cluster, which of the two sensors above does it get its input from? I think its from the one on the OFH but I'm not certain.
2. When I hook up my scanner and go to "live data", I see an "ECT" with a temp value, I think, like "98 F".
2a. So, I'm thinking ECT stands for Engine Coolant Temp?
2b. Being fed input by the temp sensor by the radiator?
If my two assumptions above are correct, 2c. What's the normal operating coolant temp for our cars?
3. Like I said in the beginning, no avail on the tips to fix this so i'm trying to go for the not so obvious.. I read somewhere (can't remember coz been browsing different forums and no one has figured this problem out, some maybe got lucky and corrected the problem with the obvious culprit) that as the engine temp rises, the oil thins, the pressure decreases.. which kinda make sense to me so i'm investigating whether engine temp has something to this baffling mystery.. or should I say misery for me now... Waaahhh! I'm the 3rd owner, got the car 9 yrs ago and my temp gauge (cluster) has always been at 12 o'clock ever since, besides when first starting the engine of course.
3a. So, if my assumption in no. 1 is correct, what is the normal operating temperature of our engine? I ask bcoz when I pop open the hood, its pretty hot! and I live where its kinda median temps all
year round.. I understand our engines gets pretty hot but it seems that it gets hotter now on mine.. maybe its psychological thinking, idk... hehe...
Hopefully someone can provide some feedback … Thanks!

[JimLev]

I deleted your other two posts, no need to ask the same question 3 times.

Have you checked the oil pressure or changed the oil pressure sensor that is in the OFH? There is also an oil temp sensor in the OFH too.

The coolant temp in the cluster gets its readings he temp sensor in the side of the engine block which in an i6 is down by the starter, IIRC.

[mattmar1]

before looking for temp as the cause of the oil light and low oil warning, prove or disprove that youre getting adequate oil pressure with a gauge tapping in to the port on the OFH. just gotta ask...have you checked your oil level on the stick?
on mine, a 528i, the temp runs tween 97 and 105 c
are you seeing any temp reading above the 12 oclock position on the gauge?
what scanner are you using? as you can read live data, AFTER ensuring you have adequate oil and oil pressure, monitor the temp while driving and see what it does.
are you ever getting a yellow oil light on the cluster after shutting down?
the oil sensor is on the OFH, they have been known to go inaccurate.

[ELA]

JimLev,

Sorry for that, I just thought I get more feedback that way.

Yes, I did just about everything I've read on numerous threads with the exception of the making a mess by removing the oil pressure switch and cranking the engine, and yes I replaced that oil/coolant temp by the OFH, too but no joy!

So wait, there's a 3rd coolant sensor by the starter? I gotta look at that.. So to clarify, the cluster temp gauge does not get its input from the temp sensor on the OFH??

Thanks, Gerry

[ELA]

mattmar1,
To answer...
Yes, oil is adequate. I did all the obvious checks and followed all tips the forums reccommended to no avail. But somehow,
i think i may have missed one obvious that i didn't think was relevant at first. Which i will explain at the end.
The temp on my car 525i M54, I travel 7-10 miles, on a 72 to 83F current weather here, runs 88 to 95C (95C is the highest i've seen, city or highway) as shown in my cluster option #7 "KTMP" and when i reached 93C is when the "STOP! Oil Pressure"
regardless on what the car is doint, braking, accell, etc. Which brings me to another question since my thermostat is 97C, so my coolant doesn't even circulate in the motor???
The gauge remains dead on 12 o'clock, except when first start the engine.
I use a MaxiDiag Elite scanner, and when i hook this up whilst drive together with the cluster option #7, the highest I've seen for "ECT" is 203F which is 95C like the highest
i've seen in the "KTMP".
No yellow oil lamp, just red flicking prior to "STOP! Oil Pressure".
So i've heard, that's why it was my first tackle... but i also learned that this oil sensor doesn't realy measure pressure, it's just a switch that at default is "on" meaning circuit
is connected that's why at first start, we see red oil lamp then goes away as soon as the oil pressure builds in the enging and pushes oil in the unit disconnecting the switch.
So here's the thing, I was gonna wait a couple of weeks until i report here but i think i've fixed my problem.
People that have done a fan delete may not like or agree with this but, it's been 2 days and no more "STOP! Oil Pressure".
Knock on wood!
I did the test by Doru, and my fan clutch is dead. I replaced that vicious clutch and wella!
I've been monitoring temp with the "KTMP" and have been reaching 93 to 95C and no more issue!
So my conclusion is that, like i read in someone's post, the heat does thin the oil and therefore lowers the pressure. I use the reccommended 5w-30.
Hope it stays fixed.
Thanks guys!

[DennisG01]

ELA:

The engine temp dash gauge has a buffer in it to prevent it from moving under normal fluctuations as that would cause some people to complain that something is wrong. If I remember correctly, the buffer is quite large.

Did you verify oil pressure with a separate gauge tapped in?

Yes, temperature/viscosity can affect oil pressure. However, I'm hard pressed to believe that this is the true problem. It sounds more like there's an issue with the pump (slightly clogged, for example) or some other electrical issue. Meaning, you shouldn't be THAT close to the low oil pressure threshold where that temp you are seeing (by itself) is causing the extreme low oil pressure. I've had cooling issues where I my temps have gotten higher than yours and have NEVER seen a low oil pressure warning. Plenty of others have posted about overheating - yet I can't remember any talking about low oil pressure, as well.

Point being... (in my opinion)... I don't think you have solved the true, underlying issue. At this point you've only put a band-aid on it.

[Chedley]

Yes, you may have fixed the over-heating issue, caused by a bad fan clutch.
But,...
that may have nothing to do with the oil pressure warning light. Try replacing the oil pressure switch : it is a cheap $5 part, that you can quickly screw and unscrew.

[ELA]

How do I post a video? It's asking for a url? I took videos of the oil pressure test...

[mattmar1]

post your video on youtube and post the url for it on here

[ELA]

Let me just back track a bit so you guys have a better understanding on what happened.. My daughter had my car (03 525i E39 M54) since Oct last year. I was working on her car (00 323i E46 M52TU similar to M54), brakes, rear wheel bearings, and other things that lit up her dash like a Christmas tree! And I completed the repairs a little over a month ago (working just on weekends). Prior to our swap back, she was already getting the dreaded flickering Red Oil Lamp and "STOP! Oil pressure" intermittently on my car, and she was worried that my car might explode!... so I took a couple of days off from work just to finish the repairs on her car.


Ok so, I have my car back.. first thing i did was changed the oil (5w-30 Castrol Edge Titanium full synthetic every since I got the cars and "normally" at 5k interval or 6mos),
and research forums about this issue,.. and replaced the Oil Pressure Sensor (switch!) right away. But, no joy!


@ Chedley... Again like what i said on my initial post #8 and my reply to JimLev #11, that I did all the tips and recommendations i've read in numerous forums EXCEPT the blowhole trick... bcoz i didn't think that it's an issue in my case (plus i didn't realy want to make a mess..). But will do so, if you knowledgeable folks reccommend that i do after watching these videos.


I did not record any video of the oil pressure prior to replacing the fan clutch bcoz i was so eager to get rid of that annoying ding and error msg. As DennisG01 and Chedley implied that it has little or nothing to do with the dreaded flickering Red Oil Lamp and "STOP! Oil pressure", so it shouldn't matter doing the pressure test with the new clutch, correct? BTW Chedley, no overheating issue whatsoever.. I just happened to read a post with similar problem that was "fixed" or remedied by allowing more cool air to enter the engine compartment (sorry I can't give credit as i don't remember who or what forum i read it). Side note: I've also seen a video where this same problem was caused by a faulty/grounded Oil Level sensor or the wiring of it, or so they claim..


Ok, I came home yesterday around 4:30pm, cooked dinner while allowing my engine to cool a bit. Installed the oil pressure gauge and around 6:30ish pm I started recording.. (pic 1) I route the gauge hose behind the wiring harness for ease of twisting. Please excuse the multiple videos as I kept on checking that the gauge fitting at the OFH wasn't leaking, and also the lighting - I hang my light inside the car for the last two videos.


Yes, DennisG01 and mattmar1, I did check the oil pressure.. And now I kinda regret that I didn't record a video before i replaced the clutch, I looked at the dash temp gauge at 12 o'clock and assumed that the car was at normal op temp and got 18psi at idle.. and that was good enough for me, i called it check! I didn't even run the a/c. I'm sure that if i did everything that i did when i shot the following videos that the psi would've been lower bcoz the fan wasn't cooling the engine as much as it did in these videos. Maybe just for the heck of it, i will put the old clutch back and check the oil pressure when it's time to change the belts, or something, coz I just replaced them and my tension pulleys
while I was in there.


First video, oil pressure at 40psi, engine not at normal operating temp as shown on dash temp gauge. Pressure was actually at 55psi at first crank.
2nd, started at 33psi with ambient temp at 76F in my garage (outside probably 72F).. revving to get to op temp, showing above 50psi at 2k rpm.. got it to 24psi at idle..
3rd, ran the a/c full blast, KTMP at 93C, revved some more.. oil pressure now at 20psi at idle.
4th, showing oil pressure sensor connector and guage hookup, and my shinny brand new clutch.. sorry for the shaking and moving, i was trying to get more light in the video..
still over 20psi at 1k rpm. I got it down to 17-18psi at idle but still not fully warmed up in my opinion. Note: The Temp Gauge on the cluster and the KTMP does not get its input from the Oil Temp sensor on the OFH, bcoz i disconneted it on this video.
5th, a/c full blast at 6:58pm still same 18psi.. break, got hungry! (not uploaded due to limitations)


After dinner, i recalled someone mentioned that to get to normal op temp one has to actually drive the car at least 30mins so at 7:44pm (pic 2) I took her for a little stroll..
6th video, I made two stops not turning engine off, got to my garage at 8:31, turn ac full (i drove with half ac power, didn't wanna turn into a popsicle..hehehe ambient temp was 68-70F) KTMP is at 93C and engine fully warmed up after 47 mins of run time, am I correct? So, oil pressure at 1k rpm is 18-20psi and at idle at 12-14psi,
depending on a/c usage.

I was planning on doing these videos in the weekend having 9hour work days but something compeled me to do it right away... yesterday lunch time at a drive-thru i saw that F******** red genie lamp flickering again!!! outside temp was 82F, a/c on nominal power, and KTMP was at 92-93C but no error msg ("STOP! Oil pressure"). So,... if my pressure readings are within specs and OPS is new, i may have a wiring issue???


I've read someone said (cnn/cn90 i think?) that on average at 1k rpm is around 10psi and that the oil pressure sensor/switch closes circuit if pressure goes 5psi or below..
As you guys seen my videos, my oil pressure never went below 12psi.

Too tired to remove the gauge and put everything back
after the last video so I took my van to work today... tmi i know.

So, are those readings within specs? Please chime in you grease monkeys!


thanx in advance you guyz!

659190 659191


https://youtu.be/sqoeLwSzUEM
https://youtu.be/KPl_SkzOtoQ
https://youtu.be/COnAcTpAxzY
https://youtu.be/-3lr3GoVFzQ
https://youtu.be/zT023pPjiBM

[RosieE39]

A long time ago I bought a 10yo sub 50k Touring for a song because the guy just wanted out of it. (He’d just bought a new F11)
Apart from just replacing the rear air springs, he had receipts for $’000’s for a new oil pump and oil filter housing.
He said that his oil light had been flickering and he was getting the message on check control about stop engine low oil pressure.
The dealership replaced the oil pump and gave it back to him but it didn’t fix the problem.
He said they then had the car for ages before replacing the oil filter housing that then fixed the issue.
I had the car for 6 years and never had a problem with it (although I did find evidence that they had run a wire straight from the oil pressure switch to the instrument cluster).
The thing is. there’s really only this one valve in the oil filter housing that could possibly cause a low oil pressure issue and BMW don’t sell it separately but those sneaky Russian’s do - https://www.ebay.com/itm/Oil-cups-valve-BMW-M50-M52-M52TU-M54-M56-/172597268691
For the price, I reckon it’s probably worth replacing it to rule it out.
The oil filter housing has to be removed to replace it so you’d be wise to replace the seal too as they’re prone to leaking.

[ELA]

RosieE39,

I replaced my OFHG about 6 years ago, not leaks there right now.. Will consider this when the time comes to remove the OFH again.

Are you saying that my oil pressure readings are not within specs? That's mainly what I want to make sure of, if the readings are ok then I will worry less about the pesky flickering light.

Thanks for the feedback!

[RosieE39]

Are you saying that my oil pressure readings are not within specs? That's mainly what I want to make sure of, if the readings are ok then I will worry less about the pesky flickering light.



This is the spec:-

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190919/51e8b44ef07229c91a573fa9bd89aabb.jpg

So you are just within spec, when at full operating temp, at a idle.

[ELA]

Thanks RosieE39!

I guess this is an electrical/electronic/wiring issue now, in which I'm not very good at.

I'm thinking about running a wire from the ops to the dash like the dealer did.. don't know how, and hoping I don't break anything.. Will probably wait for a 4-day weekend to do this.

mattmar1, DennisG01, Chedley, care to chime in? Anything I'm missing? Has anyone really found the cause of this pesky genie lamp?

[JimLev]

Did you happen to check the oil pressure with the AC off? As shown in your video the oil pressure was OK.
The wire that is connected to the oil pressure switch gets grounded when the pressure is below 7PSI. Maybe trace the wire back as far as you can to make sure the insulation isn't broken and shorting out to the chassis or engine somewhere. It's probably OK, just something to rule out.

When you do oil/filter changes do you replace the #5 o-rings?
If they are leaking they will cause low oil pressure.
https://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/showparts?id=DT43-USA-04-2003-E39-BMW-525i&diagId=11_7537

[mattmar1]

just a guess, as you did replace the OFHG some time ago. id take a close look at the wiring in its area to see if anything cracked or got pinched thru.

[Chedley]

I second mattmar1 : it is probably the oil pressure switch - a pretty cheap part to replace- or its wiring.

I agree that the oil pressure lamp is just another "idiot lamp". I mean quiet a few other things will go wrong in the engine -and you'd know it- if the oil pressure drops well below 4 psi or such...

[ELA]

JimLev, 12psi at idle and 14 when A/C is full blast as shown in the video, and it fluctuates too depending on whether the fan kicks on or not. and I replace the two tiny green orings every 3rd oil change / yearly.
JimLev/mattmar1, no obvious wiring problems from the switches/sensors connectors to the harness... not ready to tear up the umbilical chord through the cockpit, yet..
Chedley, again, oil pressure switch has been replaced when I changed the oil.. also replaced the oil temp sensor.

659409659410

I'm out of ideas...

I do appreciate everybody's input.. thanx guys!

[JimLev]

Can you get the oil pressure to flicker when the car is in your driveway?
If you can, then pull the wire off the sender and connect your meter (lowest ohms range) to the sender and ground.
See if the sender is actually reading low oil pressure. Meter should go to ~0 ohms when the pressure drops below 7 PSI.
Your pressure in the video looked good so the oil pump should be OK.
All this will do is eliminate the wire to the cluster and the cluster.

[pleiades]

Just a small comment for what it's worth .... I had a similar issue with the STOP oil pressure warning about a year back, I think. Replaced the switch (now have three!), measured oil pressure (was fine), checked continuity of wiring between the switch, DME, and cluster, all good.... Even replaced the OFHG and inspected the OFH checkvalve (all good) while I had the OFH on the bench. I also reflashed the DME on my car around that same time for other reasons and tried to re-code my LCM to disable that warning message because I knew the oil pressure was good. That was the only change I made to my LCM settings but the re-code (write) failed with an error, and examination of the hardware revealed a toasted surface-mount relay inside. Replaced the LCM with another (used) and have not experienced the STOP warning in a year or more. My car has an M52TU but it's similar to the M54 in yours ELA.

The only issue I had preceding all this was a bad voltage regulator (aftermarket "Transpo" brand purchased from a reputable supplier, Smithco in Colorado). That thing one day started "charging" my car at over 16 V, which caused all sorts of module warning messages and fault lights to display on the cluster while driving, among them the one about voltage being out of spec (can't remember the wording).

Not to lead you down another rabbit's hole but that was my experience.

[Chedley]

Just a small comment for what it's worth .... I had a similar issue with the STOP oil pressure warning
…...etc..etc..
Not to lead you down another rabbit's hole but that was my experience.

Well, it is really not a rabbit's hole, but...a word of wisdom that saved me literally thousands of dollars in parts, repairs, headaches.

Anything that may go wrong with the E39 must start with checking or testing the BATTERY / ALTERNATOR charge.

[ELA]

JimLev,

I thought about doing that, disconnecting the connector from the sending unit but not for the reasons you mentioned, but is now on my to do list..

I was thinking more like eliminating the possibility of a gremlin in my dash, If I were to disconnect whilst it's flickering and it continues to flicker then for sure, gremlins!

Although, it might be difficult to connect a meter while engine is running.. I can disconnect the connector by removing the 2 bolts on the PS reservoir and pushing it aside while sticking 2 big long screwdrivers, one to depress the spring lock and one to push the connector out/ But putting a meter without shutting the engine and removing the intake ductings might prove difficult...

But thanks though, I will surely try when the opportunity present itself.

- - - Updated - - -

Thanks pleiades, I was actually alreading looking into that LCM.. have read a couple of threads about it which relates to this problem.. will report back when i have a more definitive diagnosis.

Thanks!

[Poolman]

Hadn't been here in awhile, but here goes. With all of the work on my old ride, this flickering oil light and alarms going off. The idle was a bit low causing the oil pressure to be low and thus mayhem ensuing . Now you can chase this around all that ya want and spend dollars and such and may fix the problem for a temp period. My fix , find someone who can program the computer system and raise the idle rpm up. I raised mine up 4 hundred rpm at idle and never had the problem again, ever. Drove that 525 touring for almost 400,000 miles, until one of the members here bought her and is still going strong.Good Luck

[JimLev]

Although, it might be difficult to connect a meter while engine is running.


Do it with the engine off. Connect an alligator clip lead to the oil pressure sensor with the other end to the meter lead.
Then start the engine.