I am stumped... Please help Diagnose (Vid)

[graphikg]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ixaUrlwZJbE

I have no idea what it is. Please tell me your suggestions.

It sounds just like this in person.

[mmark.]

Vanos.


m

[EricP]

Uhhh what's all the smoke about?

Vanos + exhaust leaks + loose plugs + bent valves + bad timing? :P

[kevinwilly]

Any history on the problem?

I agree with vanos. But that is the least of your worries... Where is the smoke coming from? Exhaust leaks can sound kinda like that.

But then when you rev it, it sounds strange.

If you have an exhaust leak near an O2 sensor, it can make it run like total crap. Would explain the noise and running badly.

Basically- we need more info.

[Lawrence1]

maybe he's working a on a e30 s50 swap and the headers are not bolted in permanently ... either way it sounds like the vanos is done but because its only idling and making that much noise you might have some other issue as well.

its very hard to judge by a video but i suggest you get a mechanical stethoscope and start listening around the motor to see if you can pinpoint where the noise is coming from and then report back.

[graphikg]

The car runs, has power, but not at its full potential (and sounds like s*** obviously).

The car sounded like this, and I thought it was bent valves, so I took the motor apart and took the head to the machine shop; they said "We cant find anything wrong with this head." My compression numbers were VERY low in cyl 5 and 6 (in the 50-70 range), so I had them at least take the valves off those cylinders and inspect them and the channels. They said it was fine - so I just had the head cleaned and resurfaced.

I installed the new HG, rebuilt the vanos with the beisan kit, and still the exact same sound as it was prior to all the work. I am so confused.

My last thoughts are maybe it being a lifter issue, or maybe oil viscosity has something to do with it (I am using 15w50 mobile syn), or maybe it is a block issue like wristpins or rods.

It really does sound like valves, but that factor should be discounted now because of the machine shop. And I have been listening to a lot of Vanos problematic cars on youtube, and my car sounds just like them... So did I rebuild my Vanos unit incorrectly?

I have no clue as to what it is but more and more I am thinking Vanos.

I followed the timing accurately as possible, and the smoke is just the oil burning off the headers from all the work I did and all the oil which has landed on the headers. The oil is all burned off by now.

[ScotcH]

It does sound like lifters to me ... how long have you been idling it? It can take a whiel for the lifters to build pressure. Or some are dead.

However, low comp would not be lifters, unless thy are stuck open somehow. Retest the compression and if it still sucks, do a leak down test to confirm where it's leaking from.

[M-technik-3]

Second the leak down test. How long has this engine been sitting idle? Varnish build ups in the engine? The M3 I bought last year sat extended periods and had poor oil change schedule so it sounded like but for sometime. I ran some engine flush thru it and then changed the oil filter at halfway thru scheduled oil change.

It is now quiet with minor lifter noise on start up.

[Mad Dog 20/20]

mis-timed

[kryatov123]

chain tensioner

[graphikg]

In the video - that is my car around 7 minutes of idling time. It was at running temp by then.

You see how confused I am about all this... it can be any of these issues. I dont mind changing the chain tensioner if thats the problem, but which one could it be(primary and/or secondary)? It very well could be one of the tensioners.

The timing I can do again. That shouldnt be too bad to attack again.

When replacing the cams, I noticed some lifters were soft when I pushed them down with my own fingers, but some were solid and I couldnt even budge them with my own fingers. Before starting the car, I dumped oil all around the cam lobes and lifters, pulled the oil fuse, and cranked it to pump oil around the car... I was hoping to take care of the lifter bleeding in that attempt.

Update... The noise is practically gone now. I dont understand. I just have had it running for a little, and I have changed the oil with new fresh oil to clean out the system. The motor sounds very quiet now...

HOWEVER... it still runs like crap. I can see the dash shaking when I rev to 1500-2500 and when I drive the car, it has this crazy WOOOSHING/grinding sound around 3000-3500. It sounds kinda like a massive turbo kicking in... and this car is def not turboed. It actually sounds very wrong. It also only happens when the car is moving. If I rev it in neutral to 3000-3500 it doesnt happen.

[HaraM3]

I had the same noise as you and think you posted in my thread about it...in fact, I even had the same smoke on the headers from oil spilling during the re-assembly. I also pulled my lifters and found a couple that were soft too. Going to replace them in mine and hope that cures the ticking. However, despite the ticking my car runs great.

Weird that you are still having running issues. I already replaced the primary and secondary chain tensioners when I rebuilt my head. That is a very easy replacement, as you probably know, and see if it helps. A loose chain could make some bad noises.

[graphikg]

Ya, I read your thread and even responded to it before I re-took off my head.

I really think my lifters are bad too - so I am going to need to replace them as well and do the dreaded cam removal process (scary). Did you buy new or used lifters and from where? They are very expensive.

Was your car also running like crap despite the noise? The noise has gone away for the most part, but still shakes as something is off balance and it doesnt run well.

In my case, it could be a combonation of bad timing and bad lifters. I noticed that there were at least 4-5 that I could push down with my hand.

[Hova]

do the dreaded cam removal process (scary).


Start at one end, turn 1/4 turn at a time on each nut, work up and down until they all come out.

Should be fine.

[graphikg]

As an update... This is what the motor sounds like now. I think the Vanos just needed some oil pumped in it, since it was rebuilt and cleaned, and now the motor is much quiter. But it still runs badly and has power loss, and shakes a lot in the cabin. Thats why I put the camera in the dash for reference.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1dAAnPqn0uI

[HaraM3]

Updated my thread and wanted to cross-post since we were having similar problems. Changing out the lifters made all the difference. I went with new lifters and gently used trays due to some scoring on the old trays. Not cheap, but it got the job done...finally. I have a set of spare lifters that came with the trays, if you are interested I would sell them very cheap. The seller said they only have 58k on them, but I can't verify that of course.

Camshaft removal is not that bad. Use the Pelican Parts DIY, makes life super easy and I have now used it twice with success...http://www.pelicanparts.com/bmw/techarticles/E36-Camshaft-Removal/E36-camshaft-removal.htm When the last cam bearing cap pops you may pee a little but otherwise super straight forward.

That shaking is weird, although mine shook more than usual before too. Not that much though... Good luck man! It's a great feeling once you get it all sorted out.


Ya, I read your thread and even responded to it before I re-took off my head.

I really think my lifters are bad too - so I am going to need to replace them as well and do the dreaded cam removal process (scary). Did you buy new or used lifters and from where? They are very expensive.

Was your car also running like crap despite the noise? The noise has gone away for the most part, but still shakes as something is off balance and it doesnt run well.

In my case, it could be a combonation of bad timing and bad lifters. I noticed that there were at least 4-5 that I could push down with my hand.

[RRSperry]

It's still VANOS noise. Probably some lifters too.